Should they bring back Ski Fly

dislanddisland Posts: 1,053 Crazy Baller
edited February 2014 in Jump

Should they bring back Ski Fly 60 votes

Yes Its the ultimate X event
66%
auskierskidawgtsixamscotchipmandislandjwrHam_WallaceRichardDoanePSMBruce_ButterfieldThan_BoganjimbrakeMattPGarnEd_JohnsonBulldogigkyaMarkTimmJody_Sealjayski 40 votes
No its too dangerous
6%
JASMSSkiJayskihound 4 votes
No lets keep focusing on the night events (no one wants to ski fly at night)
26%
HortonChef23ShortenitBoneHeadRpc29londonskierlpskierral6ballsjackskiNandoandjulesTDLJWebSkiErik4cisaacd3skis 16 votes
Dave Island- Princeton Lakes
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Comments

  • Than_BoganThan_Bogan Posts: 5,621 Mega Baller
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    Sure why not. I saw it at Nationals years ago and it was entertaining enough.
    Nathaniel Bogan -- GUT Padawan
    Bulldog
  • HortonHorton Posts: 23,557 Administrator
    No lets keep focusing on the night events (no one wants to ski fly at night)
    Some or all of the below is the problem
    Requires a special boat?

    Requires a bigger lake

    Increased the rate of injuries

    To the untrained eye it is not that much of a better show

    It is perhaps a bigger spectacle but it is not a greater demonstration of skill – in other words the top guys are still the top guys.

    If this would get skiing in the x-games I am all for it but if it is just another splinter in a struggling sport, I do not get it.

    I would love to watch but I can’t see the big picture payoff

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    E_TandjulesWaternut
  • Ed_ObermeierEd_Obermeier Posts: 1,334 Crazy Baller
    Thought you were talking about the message board. My answer would have been "Oh Hell NO!"
    Ed Obermeier - owner, EZ-Slalom Course Systems
    www.ez-slalom.com
    MSjcampHorton
  • Chef23Chef23 Posts: 4,843 Mega Baller
    No lets keep focusing on the night events (no one wants to ski fly at night)
    Originally I thought why not if they want to do it but after reading @Horton's comments I went with focus on the night events.

    My question though is have the jumpers pretty much maximized the distance they can go off a 6' jump at current max speed. Unless I am mistaken the jump record hasn't been moved in a few years.
    Mark Shaffer
  • ZmanZman Posts: 956 Crazy Baller
    Guess the crazy skiers like Scot would have kept it going if it was in the best interest of their sport. Agree - sort of - that maybe from shore, not that much different. But, when I lived on Lake Tennessee and got to ride in the boat a couple times and watch the Rocketman ski fly from the other end of the rope, it was really awesome! Especially back when the Nautique he was using had turbo charge and during the cuts you would hear the high pitch as the turbo wound up. The speed, the launch, the height and distance was mind boggling.
    Blood type IPA
    BMG73
  • BMG73BMG73 Posts: 107 Baller
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    I thought the jumpers said it was safer...?
    Than_BoganJody_SealE_TTylerR
  • BulldogBulldog Posts: 942 Solid Baller
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    I think we NEED this sport back.
    Mike Loeffler - "Someone somewhere is having a real problem today...My bad skiing is NOT one of them"
    E_T
  • ntxntx Posts: 758 Crazy Baller
    Pretty sure that several of the young guns would like to. Zach, Storm, Tim,.......
    TylerR
  • BMG73BMG73 Posts: 107 Baller
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    What was the record? Was it Jaretts 299'? Anyone recall the nautique with the spider tower?
    E_T
  • BMG73BMG73 Posts: 107 Baller
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    Just googled it...
    oldjeep
  • E_TE_T Posts: 542 extraterrestrial trouble maker
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    Send the men flying! And send the little boys home to mama
    E.T. phone home!
    I like reese's pieces

    "Leave nothing on the dock"~AM
  • DustyDusty Posts: 315 Baller
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    It's fast and loud and the crashes are epic. LIke NASCAR! I don't want to do it, but I'll watch :-) Preferably holding my favorite beverage, and seated in my chair.
  • SkiJaySkiJay Posts: 2,153 Mega Baller
    No its too dangerous
    I love a spectacle and there's no question ski flying is one of the original and most extreme extreme sports, but regular jumping already takes enough talented young athletes out of the sport. It belongs in the X-Games just as it is.
    www.FinWhispering.com ... because understanding is better than memorizing
  • andjulesandjules Posts: 622 Crazy Baller
    edited February 2014
    No lets keep focusing on the night events (no one wants to ski fly at night)
    Tough one... @Horton and @Jody_Seal have both got pretty valid points.
    I think realistically SkiFlying needs a dedicated person/group to promote it - it'd be great if it was in the X-Games... but existing resources/efforts shouldn't be diverted to it. We need to make our 'regular' skiing/tournaments more engaging AND less exclusive, without introducing even more expensive and esoteric equipment.
  • MattPMattP Posts: 5,880 Moderator
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    I had a discussion with someone about SkiFly this past weekend.
    It should be in the X-Games and I may or may not have put some wheels in motion for this earlier this year..
    I remember back at Masters one year when it seemed like the first 3 women off the dock were carted off due to some hard crashes. Call me sexist but possibly just bring it back for men (at first). The top guys will still be the top guys and I think it should be limited to the top guys for safety reasons. I also remember a lot of the athletes doing ski fly did not have the ramp/facilities to practice it which made the events a little more sketchy.
    I agree with @andjules that it needs a dedicated group to run it and not take away from current resources.
    @Jody_Seal is right on the money.

    @Chef23 yea but Freddy was 1foot away this past fall.

    How is this not cool
    Skifly 299


    Jump 247
    chris_logan
  • EdbrazilEdbrazil Posts: 1,288 Historical Baller
    Somewhat echoing @mattp above. One survey alternative not available would be:
    "Yes, but do it right this time"

    More extensive comments to follow later.

    Interesting coincidence is that the snow and water Ski Fly records are almost exactly the same,
    although metric vs. feet.

    Snow: 246.5 meters. Water: 246.7 feet; 75.2m.
  • Chef23Chef23 Posts: 4,843 Mega Baller
    No lets keep focusing on the night events (no one wants to ski fly at night)
    What are the skifly differences? I know it is faster boat speed but I don't recall what the speed is and what the other changes are.
    Mark Shaffer
  • ntxntx Posts: 758 Crazy Baller
    edited February 2014
    @Chef23 I am sure that someone will get more of the details right, but just off the top of my head. The rope length was 100 feet I think. The length of the ramp out of water was several feet longer. That reduced the incline angle. I am not sure about the the height. It may have been less than 6 maybe 5 9. The boat speed was increased but I don't remember the speed 45??? maybe. The guys who did it said that they did not need to cut as late and the decrease in the incline angle was less impact. I think the jump was much more open than what we have now. Again, not sure on all the deatils but that is a start. The year they did it at nationals in Bakersfield was pretty awesome. I think that was early 2000's maybe 2001
  • Jody_SealJody_Seal Posts: 2,152 Mega Baller
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    @Edbrazil
    What was done wrong last time?
    Hobby Boats can be expensive when the hobbyist is limited on their own skill and expertise.


  • MattPMattP Posts: 5,880 Moderator
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    This site would be lost with out @EdBrazil.
    HortonTylerRbogboy
  • SkiJaySkiJay Posts: 2,153 Mega Baller
    No its too dangerous
    Perhaps the part of ski flying that is the most punishing on all of the athletes is having to travel with such enormous skies. What a pain in the A$$ that must have been!
    www.FinWhispering.com ... because understanding is better than memorizing
    Jody_Seal
  • HortonHorton Posts: 23,557 Administrator
    No lets keep focusing on the night events (no one wants to ski fly at night)
    @Jody_Seal
    Can you name 3 of the top 10 on the standings list that think it is s good idea?

    I bet some guys from 20 to 50 on the standings list would like a crack at it but I would also bet most of the top guys do not.

    I asked my pro jump insider spy about it today. The response was basically "Hell No"

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  • Jody_SealJody_Seal Posts: 2,152 Mega Baller
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    @Horton

    I already named the #1 guy in another thread! he said he would love to take a poke at the record But he aint doing it for nothing and the prize money needs to be substantial! I think that this would probably apply to a number of the top guy's.
    I in the last year have been approached by a top 10'er about a year ago to supply a big HP boat to pull a record attempt for a TV show, This did not manifest it's self but again someone is thinking about it!
    Steve-O (#30) just said hell yea! But then again he is in the 20-50 range. Steve-O had the Junior ski fly record for about 10 min (199') Then Brody Reid went out and busted a 202'.
    Hobby Boats can be expensive when the hobbyist is limited on their own skill and expertise.


  • RichardDoaneRichardDoane Posts: 3,913 Mega Baller
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    Jump is cool, Ski-Fly even cooler IMO
    BallOfSpray Pacific Northwest Vice President of Event Management, aka "Zappy"
  • EdbrazilEdbrazil Posts: 1,288 Historical Baller
    OK, adding on a few more thoughts. Ski Flying had its prime times back some 10 years ago, but I wouldn't consider it dead yet. As before, it just has to be done right.

    For starters, there needs to be an appropriate site, with plenty of training opportunities.
    And, other places to train. Scot Ellis might be able to provide that, as one location. For a
    tournament Ski Fly site, I'm thinking of Okeeheelee. Back in Year 2000, the Americas Cup
    ran in their Main Canal, with Slalom, Ski Flying, and Wakeboard. Was quite a nice and
    innovative event, and for sure it was not cheap to produce.

    Such an event would happen over at least one full week. With plenty of training and coaching
    happening. Similar to snow ski flying, the competitive rounds would not need to happen
    no matter the weather. Probably not a great spectator event, but for sure a TV event.

    Unlikely that the Main Canal at Okee would be available for that amount of time. Their
    Jump site would probably be the place. But, with the ramp location moved back Northward
    a bit. And, for sure, a brand new ramp. Yup, not cheap. The existing Video Jump towers
    would probably work, with the ramp moved back.

    I've always been a bit concerned with a 45mph (72kph) top speed, as to whether that is just
    too much. One item of the specifications to consider. I would also eliminate any towline
    length restriction. 32 meters max now. I highly doubt that much more would be practical.

    I've had some ideas about a Super-ramp that would have some special dimensions. With
    the first 1/3 being the "Impact Zone", the second 1/3 being the "Compression Zone", and
    the final 1/3 being the "Takeoff Zone". Whether anyone is willing to fork over some $50K
    for such a structure is questionable. But, the whole event would certainly need to have a
    budget around 1/2 million. (Mr. Gates, are you listening?).

    Along with the Ski Flying adhering to Rules specifications, I would also want to see some
    consideration toward an "Unlimited/Outlaw" event. You bring your boat, your driver, and
    maybe even your ramp. To my memory, back-back, Ricky McCormick had some ideas
    about that. Once again, Big Buck$ would have to be on the line.

    In the big year of Ski Flying, there was a $100K bonus for a distance of 323 feet. Likely
    was a safe bet, although the record had been advancing significantly. I would have voted
    for 300 feet. Although, there is also the 100 meter "barrier" lurking there, at 328 feet.

    My comments from guy who first water skied when the Record (yes, Mens) was under 100 feet.
    And, who lived on the lake where that "barrier" was first exceeded in 1954.
    MattP
  • InboardfixInboardfix Posts: 111 Baller
    Biggest problem w/Ski Flying was only a select few had access to a facility to practice. Don't remember anyone winning, or placing for that matter, the event that didn't have access to practice. Generally the only time most of the competitors practiced was in the actual tournament. End result was more serious crashes than occurred in regular jump. Ski fly was a part of the Masters for very few years (I'm thinking 3 but not 100% sure) and during that time period there were 2 skiers (that I remember) taken out of the water on a back board . Don't remember seeing any other skiers taken out on a back board in the 20+ other Masters I've attended/worked.

    I'm all for more excitement in the sport but not at the expense of safety. The money for the infrastructure needed to make this as safe as possible simply isn't there. How many ski sites are willing to spend the money to upgrade their ramp?

  • Jody_SealJody_Seal Posts: 2,152 Mega Baller
    Yes Its the ultimate X event
    @Inboardfix: Actually that is not true! I participated as a driver in many events and went around with one of the boats to many sites and pulled hours of practice. the jumpers / flyers involved were very helpfull and coaching each other. Jaret, freddy, Scot and Bruce were all available to anyone wanting coaching. during this time these guys were as cohesive a group as any i have seen in our sport. they all knew the consequences and they all coached each other to fly the best they could safely,actually practice time was readily available .
    funny how erroneous outside statements surface today, Ski Fly could have taken the sport to the next level but too many nay Sayers and uneducated (girly type) with influential powers had a big impact in making this aspect of our sport go away. maybe the 20-50 ranked jumpers will bring it back!
    Hobby Boats can be expensive when the hobbyist is limited on their own skill and expertise.


    E_TMattPbschipps
  • InboardfixInboardfix Posts: 111 Baller
    @jody_seal Define "many" sites? There simply weren't many Ski Fly ramps.

    Never said those pushing Ski Fly weren't helpful. Jaret, Freddy, Scot and Bruce are great guys (don't know Freddy personally but have heard nothing but good). However, I stand by my statement the majority of professional jumpers didn't have adequate practice with the ramp which resulted in inconsistency with all but the very few who had full access to a ramp and supercharged red w/silver cloud N Ski Nautique.

    Is Cory ready to drop the $ to make his site Ski Fly capable? He'd be one of the few who could justify it but even in view of his interests I'd be surprised he'd drop the change to do it. How may other sites would be willing to do it?

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