Best V-drive slalom wake?

smigforcesmigforce Posts: 8 New Baller
Hi, new to the forum and realize there have been some posts but nothing super conclusive on this topic from my view. Have been out on a mastercraft XT23 which for the size of the boat thought the wake was surprisingly manageable for slalom but surf is excellent. Is there better? We only have mastercraft, malibu and nautique in our area. For those that have spent time in the XT, GS,and BU vtx. would appreciate any input. Would love to be able to do both ski and surf (even if it means extra weighting to get a good surf wake).

Comments

  • oldjeepoldjeep Posts: 2,573 Mega Baller
    edited August 24
    Malibu VTX - 2015 or older. Although I have no comment on the surf wake since I don't surf. The 2013-2015 would have surfgate
    Chuck P
    Not a mechanic but I play one at home
  • UWSkierUWSkier Posts: 572 Crazy Baller
    Are you looking new only or is used an option? As Chuck said, hard to beat the performance and versatility of a '13-15 VTX. The '16 redesign made it a better surfer and nicer boat overall, but at the expense of skiing. They also went to a 1.76:1 reduction in the 16+ with a different prop that seems to have hardened the wakes. I know some have had luck working with Acme on repropping to improve that aspect of the boat.
  • WoodySkierWoodySkier Posts: 11 Baller
    I had a 2010 VTX, and the slalom wake was pretty good at 32 and over, slower speeds and the wake got bigger, but not huge. I used to ski the course behind it. It was an ok surf wake, but i had to add an extra 750 lbs to make it surf ropeless. This was before surfgate or these new surf devices you can stick on your boat.
  • smigforcesmigforce Posts: 8 New Baller
    New or used - just want best hull design to do both, with aim of it having a better slalom wake than a 17 xt23 (which is my current point of reference). So from the responses above it appears that the first choice to compare would be a 13-15 vtx?
  • smigforcesmigforce Posts: 8 New Baller
    I would have thought the new GS series would be a stronger contender but haven't seen too many votes for this multi-sport option.
  • oldjeepoldjeep Posts: 2,573 Mega Baller
    Also should say that the 2015 and older VTX comes in Diamond hull and wake hull versions - make sure you are looking at a diamond hull.
    Chuck P
    Not a mechanic but I play one at home
  • bigskieridahobigskieridaho Posts: 569 Crazy Baller
    Sport Nautique 200, Malibu VTX, Mastercraft X-14V would all be great options.
  • Jody_SealJody_Seal Posts: 2,149 Mega Baller

    Best V-drive slalom wake!
    Hobby Boats can be expensive when the hobbyist is limited on their own skill and expertise.


    oldjeepALPJr
  • BraceMakerBraceMaker Posts: 1,810 Crazy Baller
    edited August 24
    Infinity ZX-1 but probably not really what you're looking for.

    Would be nice if someone considered revisiting the floorplan layout of DD inboard boats. I would bet people would be fairly accepting of a DD ski tug that had a less obtrusive engine format. Maybe a transmission that had a few degrees of downturn on the output shaft so the engine could sit flatter in the hull and a dry sump. Sat a bit flatter - revisit the exhaust manifolds/intake to try to reduce the profile and slam the engine down in the hull to have the engine cover be smaller/flatter.

  • smigforcesmigforce Posts: 8 New Baller
    Can anyone comment on the difference in slalom wake between these newer vdrives, and say a mid 90s prostar 205. Will any dd always have a better wake? I ask because i know there are a bunch of older dd that people love to highlight as great wakeboarding boats - which maybe also means just "ok" slalom wake.
  • gt2003gt2003 Posts: 619 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    Why 2 pylons? One just fore of the engine compartment and one in the middle of the boat. Would slalom position be the center one?
    2016 Radar Alloy Vapor
  • dvskierdvskier Posts: 121 Baller
    Yes. Much better pull from center but still undesirable for me.
  • oldjeepoldjeep Posts: 2,573 Mega Baller
    edited August 24
    @gt2003 it depends. My vtx does not have the optional center pylon but you can ski off either the pop up or center. The center pylon is supposed to be "better" but then you are back to the limitation on where your passengers can sit as it makes the back seat useless when you have a skier out.
    (pic - not my vtx)

    Chuck P
    Not a mechanic but I play one at home
  • smigforcesmigforce Posts: 8 New Baller
    "Can anyone comment on the difference in slalom wake between these newer vdrives, and say a mid 90s prostar 205. Will any dd always have a better wake? I ask because i know there are a bunch of older dd that people love to highlight as great wakeboarding boats - which maybe also means just "ok" slalom wake."
  • BraceMakerBraceMaker Posts: 1,810 Crazy Baller
    @smigforce - The Prostar 205 came in two flavors - the 205DD and the 205V (v-drive) the 205V eventually became the X2 hull.

    I have skied the X2 and it isn't awful, but its not a slalom course boat, appreciable bounce off the wakes - and for lighter/smaller skiers there is pronounced trough on both sides of the wakes. This makes it light years better than the 19' deep V runabout I learned to ski behind.

    The simple physics is that the two hull designs are at odds - ski hulls are flatish with features to try to keep them shallow running and low displacement and surf hulls you want to settle in and displace when weighted - but with the right weight - and with a suck gate most any hull will throw a surfable wake.
  • BillbertBillbert Posts: 38 Baller
    edited August 24
    We have a 2008 VTX. Skis well for a v-drive and surfs really well for a small boat if you weight it down a bit. I have a friend with an 2004 response and at our line lengths and 32-34 mph I am hard pressed to tell the difference between the two. Response seams a little narrower but a tad more firm. Honestly after a crossing or two you don't even think about it. Slower than 32 mph and the VTX wake is noticeably bigger.

    See the pics bellow. The ski wake is at 34 mph. The surf wave is with about 2200 lbs ballast (all easily hidden in the boat) and just the driver. The surfer is about 5'10" for scale. Its a nice powerful fun wave to ride when you are to tired to ski anymore and there is still a bit of daylight.

    vlcsnap-2017-02-06-09h27m13s041
  • BillbertBillbert Posts: 38 Baller
    edited August 24
    We have a 2008 VTX. Skies very nice for a v drive at 32 mph and up, bellow that the wake gets large fast. I have a friend with an 04 response and at the line lengths and speeds we ski you are really hard pressed to tell the difference. response wake is a little narrower but also a little more firm.

    Surfing is impressive for a small boat if you add a bit of weight. the pic bellow is of the wave with 2200 lbs ballast (all easily hidden in the boat) and just the driver in the boat. Surfer is 5'10" for reference. Its a fun powerful wave thats fun to surf when your legs are too tired to ski and there is still some daylight left.

    Ski wake is at 34 mph with minimal weight in the boat.

    vlcsnap-2017-02-06-09h27m13s041

    DSC_1097

    Sometimes fliker messes the proportions when embedded here. Click on the picks to see them distorted if interested.
  • oldjeepoldjeep Posts: 2,573 Mega Baller
    edited August 24
    @Billbert - nobody ever believes me that I can't really tell the difference between 15 off @32 MPH between my 2012 VTX and an 04 LXI
    Chuck P
    Not a mechanic but I play one at home
  • PurdueSkierPurdueSkier Posts: 130 Baller
    I recently skied the course behind a sport nautique 200 V Drive, just to see if I could. I skied 34 mph. At 15 off it was not skiable. The wake was big but the rooster tail was huge. It pushed up the back of my ski as I crossed. Not good. At 22 off it was skiable and I ran the course. However I felt I was jumping wake to wake. A beginner would not be able to do this easily. Surprisingly at 28 off and shorter, only got to 35, it was a tournament quality wake. I would not hesitate skiing behind it at shorter lengths. You are in front of the rooster tail and at a very nice spot on the wakes.
  • MitzysmanMitzysman Posts: 174 Baller
    I've skied a early X2 and i would not recommend it if you ski 15 or 22 off
  • FatrollFatroll Posts: 181 Baller
    I recently free skied behind my buddies 2017 MC NXT 20' . We had the trim to ~70 I think and the wake was doable. I would describe it as spongy despite being a little bigger at 15 and 22 off. 28 off was fine. 34 mph was preferred to 32. So, course skiing may be tough if your not into shorter lines.

    My other friends nautique sport 200 was a brick wall until 28 off and shorter.
    2003 Nautique 206 2016 Radar Vapor 69.5"
    Wish they had a bonus buoy count for increased body fat index
  • BillbertBillbert Posts: 38 Baller
    @oldjeep no one ever believes me either....they look at me like I have two heads, but everyone in our ski group agrees there is very little difference between the two. Keep in mind none of us have the skill to get deep into shortline so I can not comment about the difference there. The response is new to our rotation last year, I don't know if I was more disappointed in the experience behind the response or impressed with the VTX wake. I've started to bump my speed up from 32 to 34 mph a bit this year and the VTX wake just gets better. Now if I could only summon the courage and skill to get to 36 and shorten the line a bit more. 15 off is great, rooster tail gets in your way at 22 off and I lack the skill to do much at 28 off.
    Bulldog
  • bigskieridahobigskieridaho Posts: 569 Crazy Baller
    I think everyone can agree that a V-drive is not made for skiing the course. If that is what you are looking to do buy a DD with a tower and throw some bags in to surf or buy a gate. If you are looking for open water skiing and the goods to surf and board then buy a V drive, then shorten the rope to -28 to ski open water and you will be golden. For a good note my Malibu response is weighted properly and wakes are beautiful for skiing. I throw some bags in it and put the wedge down and a surfin we will go! Just make sure you get something that you will be happy with in the end. Happy hunting!
    BillbertBulldog
  • BillbertBillbert Posts: 38 Baller
    Agree with @bigskieridaho . Flat soft wake or not the VTX is way too tubby to be in the course on a regular basis, they are plenty nimble but wide!
  • UWSkierUWSkier Posts: 572 Crazy Baller
    I primarily ski a TT 197 these days, but spent the bulk of the past 16 years behind a diamond-hulled Malibu VLX. It's a 2001 which Malibu folks will argue back and forth may even be better than the VTX/20LSV.

    From 15-28, the wake is definitely larger on the VLX, but it's softer than the TT. The disruption factor to my ski is honestly about the same or maybe only slightly more pronounced on the V. At 32 off I couldn't tell you blindfolded which was which. I don't ski any shorter than that regularly.

    This is at 34 and 36 MPH.

    It's not a course boat. Too big, tracking isn't as good, etc. It's also a terrible boat for teaching new skiers. The wake below 30 is too big and rampy.

    If you have young kids, have them try whatever you look at on the slalom ski. You might find a V may be too much wake for the youngsters.
    Fam-man
  • oldjeepoldjeep Posts: 2,573 Mega Baller
    edited August 24
    To the guys saying the VTX is too wide for the course I say - Huh? VTX beam is 98"
    2017 Malibu Response is 95"
    2017 Prostar is 96"
    2017 Nautique 200 is 95"

    OK, the VTX is a post it note wider than a response ;)

    I will agree that under 30 the wake is pretty rampy if you are going outside it. It is also really wide at 30 and under.
    Chuck P
    Not a mechanic but I play one at home
    Dacon62
  • smigforcesmigforce Posts: 8 New Baller
    So is the communities final vote then that the Malibu VLX with diamond hull is the best vdrive slalom wake?
    nzguy
  • Kdinger838Kdinger838 Posts: 55 Baller
    We didn't feel dunking a 200 this past Sunday night. so I just skied the gs 20 we were already in, and I was actually very impressed. Worth taking one for a test drive. Just doesn't track like a 200, But you can't take the family and surf a 200 either.
  • BroussardBroussard Posts: 278 Baller
    The second generation 205 became the 205V, original XSTAR, X2, and then X1 until 2011.
    Andre Broussard - Louisiana
    andjules
  • JmoskiJmoski Posts: 113 Baller
    edited August 27
    Insist on going for a test ski run behind the boat you are going to buy. The line length and speed you run will make a difference on the wake dynamic.

    Most sales videos of newer cross over boats have the skier on a very short line.
    andjulesDacon62
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