Binding location measurement location on hardshell

jercranejercrane Posts: 228 Baller
edited May 6 in Skis Fins Bindings
OK so I'm trying to reset my front binding to something close to factory as I never really measured when I moved to hardshell last year. Anyways now that I am measuring I'm not certain where to put the tape.

Option A (low): Here ... tape against the ski and butted against the plastic shell



or

Option B (high): Here ... tape at the roundest part of the protrusion in the heel cup



Do to the shape of the heel cup on the Reflex this actually makes a pretty substantial difference. Like About 1/8th of an inch and more or less one hole slot forward or backward.

I realize that at the end of the day all that matters is consistency as I make changes and continue to measure in the same exact manner. However ... I'd like to start from something close thats makes sense relative to the factory spec and go from there.



Comments

  • swaterkdswaterkd Posts: 59 Baller
    I have always used option B. Like you said just have to be consistent.
  • lpskierlpskier Posts: 2,441 Mega Baller
    Measure from the part of the boot closest to the tail. If your foot is all the way to the back of your binder, that’s about where your heel should be, with allowance for the thickness of your binder. For a more consistent measurement, you can measure from your ankle bone. The position of the “back” of your binder can vary (because your heel can be in a slightly different location binder to binder due to thickness and you can’t locate the exact position of your heel) but your ankle bone location is consistently locatable. Obviously the factory number is going to be different if it is measuring heel and you are measuring ankle. All that said, most bindings will have your heel in roughly the same spot if your foot is all the way in the back of the finding.

    Also be aware that the location of your back heel is also important. If your ski worked well with your old binders, put them back on your ski and measure the distance to tail of your front foot and your back foot. Subtract the small number from the big number and that’s your “spread.” As a starter, duplicate your spread on your new set up. Depending on your foot size, your spread should be around 12”. That may vary if your feet are size 6 vs. size 13.

    To make sure your feet are all the way back in the binder, after you are in both bindings, push your knees forward a couple times, flexing your ankles. This will move your feet back in the binder. You may find that you have to retighten your bindings because if your foot does move your binder may now be a bit loose.
    John Wilkins- Si non pro sanguine quem ludus ne. #iskiconnelly
    mmosley899
  • aupatkingaupatking Posts: 1,171 Mega Baller
    It used to be suggested that you measure directly beneath the heel block, but that strap makes that hard. What I came up with is to measure with no rear binding at all and measuring tape turned vertically so you get that “lip” under the strap. Once you get a good reliable measurement, measure from tail to the back of the Reflex plate and add the difference. That one is always easy. On mine I know to add 1/8
  • eleeskieleeski Posts: 3,782 Infinite Pandas
    First, you are moving your binding to "factory" settings from your current settings? Same ski? One you like? Make sure you mark your current settings (with a marker or scribe line) so you can come back to your baseline.

    The variations between rubber boots and hardshells are significant as to where the ankle bone is placed ( @lpskier correctly noted that it is ankle bone placement that matters - but that is a very difficult measurement to perform accurately). Furthermore, the characteristics of rubber vs hardshells will change the optimal placement. Finally, personal preferences call for wide variations in placement.

    So stressing over 1/8 in your situation is not productive. Use the measurement technique that is easiest and most repeatable. Ski it and note how it feels. Move it and ski it again. Don't be afraid of big movements (1 inch or 3 cm) - actually try some rides with that much variation.

    If nothing else, analyzing binding placement will give you a much better feel for the ski. Far more valuable than a set it and forget it approach to a vaguely specified measurement. Perfect early season skill building.

    If you find new settings that you like, mark them accurately!

    Eric
    jercranemmosley899
  • HortonHorton Posts: 26,932 Administrator
    B

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    jercrane
  • skialexskialex Posts: 827 Crazy Baller
    Right under the heel block, or in your case under the strap, so B :)
    jercrane
  • DavidNDavidN Posts: 227 Solid Baller

    jayski
  • jercranejercrane Posts: 228 Baller
    @DavidN sweet thanks, from that pic I will also interpret that as option B

  • C5QuestC5Quest Posts: 223 Baller
    Ive always used (and was told) just under the strap. Similar to option B but just pushed up a tad higher under the strap. When using a tape measure I have always used one finger to hold the end up under the strap and pulled with my right hand to tighten it up again the tail for the measurement. This ensures the play in the tape measure end tab is extended. Similar to when measuring off a sheet of wood or board. I’ve seen a few people push the end of the tape measure up against the boot but with the play in the end tab you’ll short yourself about 1/16. Anyway just what I’ve always done and seems to work. Like you said the key is consistency
  • BraceMakerBraceMaker Posts: 3,368 Mega Baller
    Of all the innovations why do none of the ski companies simply put a line across the top sheet where the center of your front ankle should sit.

    Then you wouldn't even need to measure for your first set up, mark your plate when you get a new boot and drop it on.
    jercraneMickeyThompson
  • C5QuestC5Quest Posts: 223 Baller
    By looking at your picture for option B and pushing the tape up a little bit under the strap there doesn’t seem to be any difference. You’ll probably be more consistent with something to wedge against using the strap.....but who knows maybe I’m completely screwed up and my bindings are jacked 😳
  • klindyklindy Posts: 2,206 Mega Baller
    @C5Quest FYI as long as you measure it the same you’ll be fine but actually the reason the ends of tape measures are loose is so that the end can slide in or out whether you’re measuring an “inside” distance or “outside” (hooking the tape) distance. The slop in the end of the tape is the thickness of the metal end. Again not a problem if you measure it the same but if you tell someone else the dimension you’re communicating a distance that’s actually 1/16” longer than it is.
    Keith Lindemulder
    AWSA Vice President
    jercraneDrago
  • C5QuestC5Quest Posts: 223 Baller
    edited May 6
    Like I said, what do I know. I’m probably way screwed up. I just looked and my strap is exactly where I should measure anyway
  • C5QuestC5Quest Posts: 223 Baller

    jercrane
  • BraceMakerBraceMaker Posts: 3,368 Mega Baller
    @klindy the tape does however work better in tension. I see about 1/8 difference between a skinny metal tape and a thick metal tape and about 3/16ths between a skinny tape that and a steel drafting rule with a slider.
  • skialexskialex Posts: 827 Crazy Baller
    @klindy good point, that’s why you push against the shell when measuring, well that’s what I do.
    klindy
  • jercranejercrane Posts: 228 Baller
    edited May 7
    Oh jeez, now I have to go buy a $60 drafting ruler or I won't be able to ski on my rig
    :D
    klindy
  • eleeskieleeski Posts: 3,782 Infinite Pandas
    Or just spend $60 on gas and a magic marker for a placement trial and mark the setting that gets you a PB!

    Eric
    jercraneSteven_HainesDragoklindy
  • BraceMakerBraceMaker Posts: 3,368 Mega Baller
    @jercrane agree with eric don't bother!

    Why I mentioned it is just that if you think you're right on factory but it doesn't ski well....
  • jercranejercrane Posts: 228 Baller
    sarcasm is very hard to convey on the internet
    Horton
  • jhughesjhughes Posts: 871 Mega Baller
    Thread jack- have any of you RTP guys figure out how to not smash your toes on the silveretta bars? This was a real non starter for me with trying a front HS.
  • jercranejercrane Posts: 228 Baller
    edited May 7
    @jhughes I don’t have a problem with the 840 release. I skied in my buddy’s trick that had 740 release and did smash my toe though.
  • skierjpskierjp Posts: 692 Crazy Baller
    Good tape measures are designed with play on the end for a reason. if you are hooking and pulling or butting it up against what you are measuring. This slack is exactly the thickness of the hook. Ask any good trim carpenter.
    Rednucleusjercranejhughes
  • jhughesjhughes Posts: 871 Mega Baller
    @skierjp mind blown.
    MattP
  • klindyklindy Posts: 2,206 Mega Baller
    @skierjp that's the same thing I said above.
    Keith Lindemulder
    AWSA Vice President
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