Rankings VS Region

2 questions and this is probably simple for most of you...

1 If a skier doesn't plan to go to a Regional or Nationals event, does it really matter what region they ski in?
2 Will the skiers average be the same regardless?

We don't have any tournaments scheduled for the state right for the rest of the year so I will have to travel to ski. The closest place is in another Region (SO).
Brandon Atkinson

Comments

  • WishWish Posts: 8,540 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    No Nationals, no Regionals, no problems skiing anywhere you want.
    >>> 11.25..a different kettle of fish. <<<
  • lpskierlpskier Posts: 3,782 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    Well, depending on how you expect to ski, it could make a big difference. The Southern Region is arguably the most competitive of the Regions, while the Eastern Region is less so. Your score in the South might be middle of the pack, while the same score could get you a medal in your division in the East.

    For example, there are six Womens 2 slalom skiers in the East, none of whom competed in Regionals or Nationals last year. If you are a w2 skier and you ski Eastern Regionals, you stand a good chance at medaling. There are 11 Womens 2 slalom skiers in the south, four of whom competed in Regionals. There are seven level 8 skiers and one Level 9 skier. The East has one level 8 W2 slalom skier. A full pass at 15/34 could get you a medal in the East and could be last place in the South.

    Okay, if you are Mens 2, 3, 4 or 5, the competition is pretty good, and the last two M2 National Slalom Champions have been from NY. But, if you can ski your own Region and have a chance to medal, why ski out of region? A Regional Medal is a real achievement for most folks.

    What state are you in?

    John Wilkins
    Host and Tournament Director, 2014 Eastern Regionals
    John Wilkins- Si non pro sanguine quem ludus ne. #iskiconnelly
  • klindyklindy Posts: 2,901 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    You're right, it doesnt matter where you ski if you have no intention to skiing the regionals or nationals. However, as @lpskier notes, if you do ski Regionals or Nationals, where you ski (practice and tournaments) may matter. The typical default is to ski the regionals where your permanent address is located but there are exceptions.

    Your average will be the same regardless. The database can filter "east" region skiers (or any other region) so you could see your ranking among skiers in your region and, in this case, your assigned the region based in your address.

    So ski wherever you want and have fun!!
    Keith Lindemulder
    AWSA Chairman of the Board

  • Onside135Onside135 Posts: 457 Crazy Baller
    edited April 2014
    @501Brandon...From the AWSA rulebook. Section 4.03. I think paragraphs 1 &3 contain what you are looking for...

    Link-->http://www.usawaterski.org/pages/divisions/3event/2014AWSARuleBook.pdf

    4.03 Regional Tournament Qualifications

    A. General: Each Region shall determine the required qualifications for its own Regional Tournament.

    1. In any year, a skier shall be qualified to enter only one Regional Tournament for placement. A skier shall ski for placement in the Region where he does more than half of his tournament skiing during the ten weeks prior to the Regional Tournament. A skier has the option to return to his Region of legal residence to ski for placement.

    2. Yadda yadda yadda...blah blah blah...

    3. If the skier has not done more than half his skiing in the ten-week period in any single Region, he shall ski in the Region in which he has skied most. If a skier is in doubt as to the Region in which he is qualified to ski, he shall present all the facts to the Regional Executive Vice President in the Region in which he has legal residence prior to July 16th immediately preceding Nationals and the Regional Executive Vice President’s decision shall be final. If there is any question regarding a particular skier’s Region, the Executive Vice President is required to rule based on the legal residence of the skier. This may be accomplished with the information contained in the USA-WS membership database. A skier skiing “out of Region”, based on the ten-week rule, may thereby satisfy the requirement to compete in a Regional Tournament to qualify for the National Tournament (Rule 4.02.A), and may ski for rankings only. He may not ski for Regional placement.
  • GOODESkierGOODESkier Posts: 1,107 Crazy Baller
    New to AWSA this year. Looking to see how you qualify for regionals or nationals?
    2003 Nautique 196 LE Star Gazer & ZBox - GOODE NANO OneXT 66.75" - Powershell 5 (LFF) - Tournament PB: 2 Balls @ 39.5' OFF (34.2 MPH) on 7/18/2015 at BIG DAWG BROHO!
  • 501Brandon501Brandon Posts: 144 Baller
    Thanks for the input... I was fairly clear on the Rulebook however there are always the hidden pros and cons which is what I was looking for as @lpskier‌ pointed out. I live in Central AR (SC Region) and all the scheduled tournaments at this point are in TX, OK, LA... I skied at Cottonwood a few years back (my first ever C or R event) which is the closest venue "In Region". I would like to ski at a Regional I just don't think I can get enough events in to qualify and of course the other part is skiing well enough at those few events to get my average up enough.


    Brandon Atkinson
  • ForrestGumpForrestGump Posts: 6,372
    edited April 2014
    Brandon, have you checked with Roger Boskus and Scott Greenwood? Roger is in Fayetville and Scott is outside of Little Rock. Although they don't have tournaments listed in the guide, they usually will hold a couple each throughout the year. If you need contact info, let me know.
    Shane "Crash" Hill

  • 501Brandon501Brandon Posts: 144 Baller
    @ShaneH‌ spoke to SG yesterday, said he wasn't planning on doing anything other than the JR US Open event in early June. I haven't reached out to RB yet. I need to get some ratings and get a few other folks some ratings and just hold an C event every Saturday at our club... We have an excellent venue just no qualifications...
    Brandon Atkinson
  • klindyklindy Posts: 2,901 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    Ditto to what @ShaneH‌ said. I was as Rogers this last weekend. Likewise, there are at least two sites in Memphis. One generally holds a tournament or two.

    @GOODESkier‌ you use the ranking list to get qualified for regionals (and likely the Nationals). First, all your scores are put into a database where it averages your top three scores from different tournaments. If you ski less than 3 tournaments your score is "penalized" a certain percentage depending on the type of tournament (Class C or E or L) you skied at. The calculation always looks at all the possible combinations of scores to give the skier the best average possible.

    All skiers (per age group and event) are then ranked in order of their average. The list is further divided into "levels" (generally each 10 percentile is a different level but there are some exceptions). For example level 8 is typically the top ten percent of the skiers in a group.

    Each region has its own rules to determine eligibility at its regional tournament. Most regions you require you to be a level 6 (or level 5) skier to qualify for the regional tournament. Sone regionals also allow you to qualify with a placement score at your state tournament. I don't recall the Western Regions qualifications off hand.

    At nationals you need to have a level 8 rating. And you MUST ski at your regionals to be qualified for nationals. You may also place in the top 5 at your regionals to qualify for nationals if you don't have a level 8 ranking list score.

    The average that matters is your "last 12. Months" average so it's always changing. Old tournament scores roll off the average and new scores are added.

    There's a few more details involved but that's generally the idea. Any questions post them here or let me know.
    Keith Lindemulder
    AWSA Chairman of the Board

  • WishWish Posts: 8,540 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    "you MUST ski at your regionals to be qualified for nationals"

    @GOODESkier‌ with permission from the affected regional directors you can ski a Regionals out of region. I've done it twice. You may not be allowed to place (win anything). It may just count as a regular tournament and go tawords rankings but DOES get you a spot at the Nats if all other qualifications have been met. At least that's what it was last season for me.
    >>> 11.25..a different kettle of fish. <<<
  • klindyklindy Posts: 2,901 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    Yeah @Wish‌ is correct. The sentence I wrote isn't as precise as it should be. Basically you have to ski at A regionals. Generally you ski at the regionals where you live. But as @Wish‌ said you can get permission from the two EVPs of your region and the one you want to ski at and ski at an alternative regionals. You can also get a medical (or potentially other) excuse from skiing regionals but don't count on it unless it's unusual circumstances.
    Keith Lindemulder
    AWSA Chairman of the Board

    Wish
  • ntxntx Posts: 847 Crazy Baller
    @501Brandon
    I will give you the simple answer.


    1 If a skier doesn't plan to go to a Regional or Nationals event, does it really matter what region they ski in? No


    2 Will the skiers average be the same regardless? Yes


    Simple.
  • smanskismanski Posts: 47 Baller
    For the Memphis area tournaments, when you ski at Summers Lake, you are skiing in the Southcentral Region. Hilliard's (Crews) lake is in TN and is in the Southern Region, but Summers Lake is across the state line in MS. We have 2 tournaments before Regionals (late May and late June) and 1 after Nationals at the end of August. Roebuck can give you the exact dates. Cedar Ridge (Jackson, MS) also runs class C tournaments along with most of their record tournaments.
    Scott Hudson
  • lpskierlpskier Posts: 3,782 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    @ntx Answering the question directly, succinctly and accurately is never as much fun as discussing what you really want discuss, regardless how far afield of the question, and somehow relating it back generally to the topic at hand. A simple "No" and "Yes" may be the complete and correct answer, but they are real conversation killers. On the other hand, if you are ever a witness in a deposition, those are your two "best answer" options. ;-)
    John Wilkins- Si non pro sanguine quem ludus ne. #iskiconnelly
  • ntxntx Posts: 847 Crazy Baller
    @lpskier‌ my attorney also taught me to count to ten in my head before I answer. That gives him time to object if needed. I like to get the answers. I don't need all the other stuff.
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