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ZO Surging

tonytony Posts: 23 Baller
Is anybody having problems with ZO holding speeds and surging at differant points in the course?
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Comments

  • Jody_SealJody_Seal Posts: 3,051 Mega Baller
    A lot of issues right now, what year boat and model?
    Hobby Boats can be expensive when the hobbyist is limited on their own skill and expertise.


  • marknmarkn Posts: 369 Crazy Baller
    My old 2004 196 Limited you retro-fitted years ago continues to work flawlessly. MWN
  • LeonLLeonL Posts: 2,414 Crazy Baller
    Your symptoms sound like bad pucks. I've heard that current model boats are experiencing 70% failure rate.
    Leon Leonard Stillwater Lake KY - SR Driver SR Judge
  • bgturfbgturf Posts: 23 Water Ski Industry Professional
    Do a check of the pucks to see if they are working. I unplugged one on my 2015 and it is fine now. They run fine with one puck
  • LeonLLeonL Posts: 2,414 Crazy Baller
    @bgturf that sounds unusual. They always seem to run fine on one, true, but one bad connected should not influence the good one.
    Leon Leonard Stillwater Lake KY - SR Driver SR Judge
  • blockblock Posts: 172 Baller
    It is likely a puck issue. The firmware on the new pucks is not working well with ZO. If you can find an older puck, try it . You don't need both pucks, just try one and unplug the other.
    John Seiler
  • sunperchsunperch Posts: 267 Crazy Baller
    @Jody_Seal Is Garmin replacing the bad pucks, has anyone tried to get them replaced under warranty?
  • Razorskier1Razorskier1 Posts: 3,425 Mega Baller
    We have a problem with our new 2015 txi club boat. Told it is a big issue.
    Jim Ross
  • Jody_SealJody_Seal Posts: 3,051 Mega Baller
    @sunperch
    From Will Bush: "I am being told that any puck with a serial number AFTER - 19P053497 is the new hardware/software. This should help to identify which pucks are currently at issue."

    Also-I have had contacts with MasterCraft, Malibu and Nautique concerning erratic behavior with recent 2015 installs of Zero Off.

    After investigation, it appears to comes down to the Garmin Puck - GPS 18x 5Hz with a new chipset . According to Garmin, the original GPS chip - MT3318 used in the GPS 18x 5Hz puck, we have been using, has been discontinued. The new chipset in the GPS 18x 5Hz puck is MT 3339. The new puck was first release with firmware version 3.90. It has subsequently been updated to firmware version 4.00.

    I have tested several samples of the new puck, sent to me by two of the towboat manufacturers. They are unacceptable for our use in three event skiing. For example, in the slalom mode with no skier, upon engagement ZO will over shoot the target speed (higher than the intended elevated gate speed outside the course); then enter the course and not make a quick adjustment to the new target speed. In other words, it is slow to adjust. As the boat moves down course (second half) the speed begins to fall below target to correct for times. In other instances, once the boat engages, the boat speed will drop significantly as your approach the 55M buoys, then over shoot just prior to the entrance gate and be a bit erratic in the course. While times are typically in tolerance, the ride is unacceptable.

    I have updated the firmware version to 4.00, with no improvement in results.
    All testing has been done with known good boats. Switching back to the Garmin pucks with the prior chipset (w/firmware version 3.40) results in everything returning to normal.

    That was From the tow boat committee

    As for Garman replacing them??? I know the new boats that are affected are being replaced from the boat manufacturer, right now ZO is trying to recoup from Garman and is asking them to step up and replace affected units at no charge.
    Also be aware that the ECI receivers are just around the corner and conversion hardware and software will be available soon... hopefully priced right.
    We ran this ZO/ECI system at the masters and have logged many hours and it seems to be superior in performance then the Garman setup.
    Hobby Boats can be expensive when the hobbyist is limited on their own skill and expertise.


    oldjeepThan_Bogan
  • blockblock Posts: 172 Baller
    Thank you Jody. I didn't know how far To go in explaining the issue , you did it all.
    John Seiler
  • Razorskier1Razorskier1 Posts: 3,425 Mega Baller
    Guess I got lucky -- my 2015 ProStar must have older pucks -- runs perfect! I'm glad, because I can't tell you how frustrated I'd be right now if my ZO didn't work!
    Jim Ross
  • Jody_SealJody_Seal Posts: 3,051 Mega Baller
    @kfennell ,
    The ECI/ZO is a single antenna set up rather then a dual Garman. from what I am told it produces a cleaner dialog with the ZO system. this antenna has been run on the wake boats for a number of years in conjunction with ZO speed control. Between Will, Andy and Freddy K they have been working pretty hard to bring this version to skiers and make it retrofit-able.
    Hobby Boats can be expensive when the hobbyist is limited on their own skill and expertise.


  • ozskiozski Posts: 1,706
    So if its a known issue are they still shipping product with suspects pucks?
    'Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better.'' 2021 MC As soon as it lands Ski - KD Platinum

  • smanskismanski Posts: 47 Baller
    I went through 3 bad pucks on my 2015 and finally the 4th was good. It was a horrific pull with the bad pucks.
    Scott Hudson
  • I5boiI5boi Posts: 155 Baller
    How are the 2015 carbon pros? Any issues? Are there updates?
  • LeonLLeonL Posts: 2,414 Crazy Baller
    @Jack Kinne , yes ZO will function properly with one puck. Previously some pucks failed. As long as you had one good one everything worked. If the second failed, obviously you were out of luck. Failure of a puck could be determined by going to the diagnostic screen. With the current puck problem there will be no diagnostic indication due to the fact that the puck did not fail, it's just incompatible with the system. Correct me if I'm wrong on this @Jody_Seal.
    Leon Leonard Stillwater Lake KY - SR Driver SR Judge
  • skiboat38skiboat38 Posts: 129 Baller
    Leon you are close....the system will work with one puck, however if both are connected and one is bad the boat will act erratic depending on which pick the GPS locks on to when the boat is started. They should be tested with only one connected, once the system locks onto a puck it will stay on that puck until the system is turned off with the red switch on the kick plate below the driver.....I am on puck #5 in my 15
  • LeonLLeonL Posts: 2,414 Crazy Baller
    Tim, when you say "bad" you're refering to the current crop of pucks right? The older pucks sometimes just failed (rarely it seems) and in those situations a failure by one didn't cause erratic behavior did it? John's '10 boat had both fail but it seemed ok while running on one. At least I didn't notice anything when I drove it.
    Leon Leonard Stillwater Lake KY - SR Driver SR Judge
  • skiboat38skiboat38 Posts: 129 Baller
    They don't fail completely they are just too slow to react causing the boat to surge.....I have been testing pucks all morning and had one from last year and one of the new ones that were unacceptable today. My boat will show up at your tournament next week with one puck on it.
  • ozskiozski Posts: 1,706
    Would we be in this situation if ZO did not have a monopoly?
    'Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better.'' 2021 MC As soon as it lands Ski - KD Platinum

  • RAWSkiRAWSki Posts: 755 Mega Baller
    Good Question @ozski .....AWSA has never approved more than one speed control so the monopoly is a problem they have perpetuated. And yes unfortunately even if there were two approved systems most boats would only have one and the way they are integrated into the boat displays it wouldn't be easy or inexpensive to convert to the speed control system that works that month!
  • LeonLLeonL Posts: 2,414 Crazy Baller
    Let's get this back up to the top again with a new question. You promo guys (and anyone with a '15) fess up now. How many of you are experiencing problems such as those described by @Jody_Seal and Will Bush? Based on the fact that all pucks after the serial number noted by Jody are slow communicating there must be a lot of '15 boats with them.
    Leon Leonard Stillwater Lake KY - SR Driver SR Judge
  • hiddenskierhiddenskier Posts: 11 Baller
    My 15 CC had a surging issue this year as soon as I started skiing behind it. Seemed to be worse with heavier skiers and deeper short line. Most the time the skier didn't notice it but I could hear and feel it while driving. Was told to unhook both pucks and plug just one back into the system. So far that has worked fine and the boat feels and ski's great.
  • MISkierMISkier Posts: 3,041 Mega Baller
    Our ski club '15 TXi is working fine. No issues.
    The worst slalom equipment I own is between my ears.
  • skierjpskierjp Posts: 889 Crazy Baller
    Mine works great, over 60 hours.
  • skierjpskierjp Posts: 889 Crazy Baller
    I coordinate the Southern and Eastern Region and only know of 3 boats that had a problem. I think Nautique has every Promo Team member in a 15 except for 8 or 9 guys.
  • jipster43jipster43 Posts: 1,445 Crazy Baller
    Our '15 TXi has surge issues. We'll disconnect one puck at a time and see if that solves the problem.
  • thompjsthompjs Posts: 542 Solid Baller
    My 2015 TXi has one puck that is 33 pucks after the number Will published. It has the surge. I have two other pucks behind that number and they are working correctly.
    Mick04
  • ozskiozski Posts: 1,706
    So is it a raffle if you order a new unit off the shelf? I have one on the way ordered about a week ago...
    'Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better.'' 2021 MC As soon as it lands Ski - KD Platinum

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