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hardshells, FM Evo and tricking

epyscsepyscs Posts: 74 Baller
edited January 2010 in Skis Fins Bindings
<p>
hey guys.  Has anyone tricked using a FM Evo binding?  Looking to give
hardshells a go and am not so sure about the silveretta releases
consistency (and yes I know loads of people use them), but
unfortunately I ski in a salt water lake regularly and wouldnt want the
'hassles' of lots of maintenance.
</p>
<p>
I figure the evo binding will still release in a similar way to a
rubber boot (previously only used animals) when needed, however
concerned about how much holding force it will have for flip back
landings, ski and toe line tricks?
</p>
<p>
Opinions welcome!
</p>
<p>
Cheers...
</p>
<p>
 
</p>
<p>
<em>Oh and any tips on releasing a fin adjustment screw on a new ski...?  Locked up solid and need to move fin back a tad. </em>
</p>

Comments

  • Thomas WayneThomas Wayne Posts: 550 New Baller
    <p>
    Re: the seized screw - if possible remove the fin block and fin from the ski; position the block sideways (in a vise or something) with the screw "head" facing upward.
    </p>
    <p>
    Saturate the screw and screw-hole with <em>penetrating oil</em>, and keep doing this for a day or two until you can unscrew it.  If you've galled up the drive hole such that an allen wrench will no longer work you'll have to buy or borrow the correct size "easy-out" bit to remove the screw, but use the penetrating oil first if you want to ensure not damaging the threads in the hole itself.
    </p>
    <p>
    TW
    </p>
    <p>
    (PS: Kroil is the brand I use - http://www.kanolabs.com/google/ )
    </p>
  • eleeskieleeski Posts: 3,975 Infinite Pandas
    edited January 2010
    TW is right about Kroil (better than Liquid Wrench) and the patience. One more trick that might help is to add heat. But chances are that none of this will work. Drill out the allen screw so that the EZout fits all the way in. Also the drilling seems to help weaken the lock in the threads. This might not work either. Keep enlarging the hole in the set screw until it either comes out or is drilled out. Now you will have to re-tap the screw. If you were lucky and careful you can tap the same size threads. Otherwise you will have to go a size bigger or use a helicoil insert. At worst (broken EZout that you can't remove so you have to grind the screw off) you will end up without an adjusting screw and have to tap the fin to move it. When you put the thing back together, use antisieze on every machine thread. Even more important for salt water use - never screw in machine threads without antisieze and only use stainless! #

    Hardshells are a lot of maintenence. But for tricks, the performance gain is real. There are some good skiers on rubber but the learning curve is faster on a hardshell. I'd recommend the switch - even with some maintenence hassles. Rusted clips and rotten rivets add to the eventual decay of the hardshell. But the cost and hassle is worth it for me.#

    We ski a fair amount in salt water (and I don't rinse my skis). Silveretta clips last OK in salt water for us. They are available in the snow ski market as well so replacement is reasonable. But I personally hate them. I don't like to come out ever on tricks. I get lots of pre-releases with the Silveretta style. When it releases, I bash my shin into the clip and get a nasty cut. Wear a shin guard when you are learning new tricks. Lots of skiers put a snowboard clip over the middle of the hardshell to hold it on permanently. The FM style toepiece is better than the SkiTechnic horseshoe because of the adjustability factor - but there is another clip to maintain.#

    Often when I fall the liner comes out of my shell so the release mechanism of the EVO (or RS1) is valid - if I understand how it works (but I haven't seen or skied the EVO).#

    I currently use a hardshell with an Intuition style liner bolted to the ski with sacrificial Gatorade lid washers. I release so that my ski or shell is less apt to break. My knees are stronger than the equipment for a normal fall and a fluke fall will hurt me no matter how a release works.#

    Eric
  • D WoltersD Wolters Posts: 139 Baller
    <p>
    epyscs,
    </p>
    <p>
    If you have to break out the drill and easy out do yourself a favor, buy a couple of left handed drill bits. There's nothing worse then an easy out broken off in a stuck set screw or bolt.
    </p>
    <p>
    When using the bits run your drill in reverse. It doesn't work every time but you'll be suprized when the set screw backs itself out while drilling the hole. I bought an entire set of bits after learning this little trick! 
    </p>
  • epyscsepyscs Posts: 74 Baller
    <p>
    cheers for the responses on the screw guys... have been soaking the block in CRC Marine since yesterday morning.  No luck yet so might crack out a drill bit.
    </p>
    <p>
     As for the boot... Eric - how does this gatorade lid thing work?  The reason I ask about the evo series is I was led to beleive they are fairly new, hence not many people would be riding them yet, whereas the reflex is more widely used as it has been available much longer.
    </p>
    <p>
     for hands would defo prefer to be lock into the ski as my back foot is well strapped in, however use the same ski for both runs and dont want to change skis for each run (like quantum for both).
    </p>
    <p>
     Cheers...
    </p>
  • Thomas WayneThomas Wayne Posts: 550 New Baller
    <p>
     
    </p>
    <p>
    Regarding the FM evo binding, I believe this is the same method and manner of release developed by O'Brien for their new Elite binding.  If so I would be inclined to think they're more likely to have integrated the design of the various parts and pieces, rather than modifying existing boots, etc.
    </p>
    <p>
    When in doubt, go with the big company that is the <em>Gold Standard</em> for customer service, and has been around for many decades, IMO.
    </p>
    <p>
    TW
    </p>
  • eleeskieleeski Posts: 3,975 Infinite Pandas
    <p>
    Reflex is the Gold Standard. But it still sucks. I've been cut up by it. Forest Fisher dislocated his knee when the Silveretta pre released but his rear foot stayed in on a flip. Many top skiers no longer use that system for various reasons - maintenence being a main one. Hardshells are a relatively new development with a small market and a small development budget. Hardshell Gold Standard is still pretty experimental. The Reflex is affordable, does work well, release acceptably and last long enough to win a lot of tournaments - but it is not the end of boot and release evolution. Time will tell if the Evo is a true improvement but it may be a positive step.
    </p>
    <p>
    Epyscs, if you don't trust the Evo release you might be able to adapt the gatorade lid release. Drill out the plate at the binding holes oversize (5/16 or 8mm). Hold the plate down with a washer made out of plastic Gatorade lid. In a bad fall, the gatorade lids will break away and let the boot release from the ski. But I need 3 inserts on each side to keep the boot mounted well enough - so it might not stay on adequately with the one factory insert per side. Also, the Evo might release from your foot and from the ski - ending up on the bottom of the lake! I had to do a fair amount of development to find the right number of holes and placements for my Gatorade releases. My setup is more like the Powershell (another Gold Standard) - with Gatorade lids instead of Interlock.
    </p>
    <p>
    Your best bet is probably to run the Evos loose for toes if you want easy release capability for that. Cinch the boots really tight for hands if you want no release there. TW is right that the Evo is the result of a lot of quality R&D and the release can probably be made to work reasonably well. Hopefully the performance will be good for tricks. Let us know!
    </p>
    <p>
    Eric
    </p>
  • MattPMattP Posts: 6,204 Mega Baller
    Reflex has worked really well for me over the past few years with only one bad pre release.
  • epyscsepyscs Posts: 74 Baller
    <p>
    well I am considering doing a demo - will speak to FluidMotion and will see what they can do as will be a fairly expensive trial (especially with shipping to this half of the rock).  If I do, I will be sure to post an update on here!
    </p>
    <p>
     Cheers guys.
    </p>
  • epyscsepyscs Posts: 74 Baller
    <p>
    Unfortunately I got an email from Paul at FM and it looks like the demo programme is limited to the US / Canada.  Its a bit of a shame really as the evo looks like it could be good for tricking without the negatives of the silvretta release. 
    </p>
    <p>
    I think its a fair wedge to be spending on a binding when I am not able to get enough feedback of others using if for tricking so will not pull the pin on it at the moment.  I might have to get on the case and build myself another custom animal again.
    </p>
    <p>
     Again, thanks for the responses... ski good guys.
    </p>
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