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Do barefooters want a tower? Are barefooters extinct?

escmanazeescmanaze Posts: 757 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
The way I've understood it is that guys who barefoot want to do so behind a tower for the higher tow point. Am I wrong saying that?

Assuming I'm not wrong, then are barefooters extinct? Where have they all gone? Looking through ski-it-again and boattrader, I see VERY few 200s and Prostars with Towers. TXIs have a little higher percentage because of the obvious wedge advantage as a crossover boat into wake sports (which is why I'm into towers, for the wake sports and the place to store the wake boards) but I guess I would expect to see more 200s and prostars with towers if there are still a reasonable number of footers in existence who prefer a tower tow point.

What am I missing?
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Comments

  • oldjeepoldjeep Posts: 3,497 Mega Baller
    The new boats can barely get out of their own way at ski speeds, the local barefooters I see are using older boats.
    Chuck P
    Not a mechanic but I play one at home
    wtrskiorBrennanKMN
  • 6balls6balls Posts: 5,329 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    Yep, footers use footing boats. Outboard Malibu Flightcrafts, outboard Sangers and inboard Sangers...and yes towers or a fly high pole are a plus.
    The speed and as much so the wake are important for footers. Our inboards today are not necessarily designed to throw a proper barefoot wake.
    The towers you will see on any newer inboards are not likely barefoot specific but trying to please the wake-boarders in the family, or simply getting the rope up high and thus being able to use the back seat for recreational towed stuff without back seaters getting ropes across the neck...useful just about anything other than real slalom.
    Dave Ross--die cancer die
  • WishWish Posts: 7,983 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    Just like barefoot boom raised up with handle is easier to foot off of do to higher pull point, so is long line behind the boat with higher pull point.
    >>> 11.25..a different kettle of fish. <<<
  • burdhntrburdhntr Posts: 34 Baller
    My MC 197 (2003 with the Cadillac 6.0) does great for footin. I just have the mini tower for longline and its more than adequate.
    6balls
  • 6balls6balls Posts: 5,329 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    @burdhntr buddy had that same boat, same engine, same tower worked great.
    Dave Ross--die cancer die
    burdhntr
  • AndyAndy Posts: 213 Baller
    My 89 BFN.
  • LoopSkiLoopSki Posts: 641 Crazy Baller
    Sanger will still make the DXII. I met Scott Pellaton at the boat show and talked about it for a bit.

    It's not dead , just think it's like slalom. Hidden
  • escmanazeescmanaze Posts: 757 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    Hmmmm...interesting.

    Sounds like barefooting is a cautionary tale for slalom. Sport has gone so small that only one manufacturer even kind of still makes the type of boat the folks are looking for. Wow. So then I think my comments about barefooting being extinct are actually not all that far off. From a boat manufacturers perspective, it is indeed, just a hidden sanger model away from being completely extinct.
  • keithh2oskierkeithh2oskier Posts: 588 Crazy Baller
    Was barefooting ever the size of slalom though @escmanaze? I have spent my fair amount of time at private and public waterways and it seems footin has always been a very VERY small percentage of the towed watersports. Like sub 1% of all the slalom skiers I know/met did any barefooting on a semi-regular basis in the last 20 years. I bet its well under 1%...
  • oldjeepoldjeep Posts: 3,497 Mega Baller
    edited April 2017
    Dunno, every time we stay on public water there are always a few bare footers out at sunrise and sunset. Seem to be plenty out there. But some folks don't realize that better than 50% of comp boats never see a course. ( at least around here). Most of the ones I see are long line off early 2000 comp boats back when you could hit 40 in a reasonable distance without a 10k engine upgrade, rarely an OB and the only hydrostreams I see belong to a local ski club.
    Chuck P
    Not a mechanic but I play one at home
  • 6balls6balls Posts: 5,329 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    @keithh2oskier agree...though back in the heyday of water skiing and the pro-tour...footing got a lot more press as well.

    Banana George, Mike Seipel, Ron Scarpa. The first Ski Centurion Warrior Barefoot Comp, the outboard Flightcraft, the outboard Sanger, the inboard Sanger, the Barefoot Nautique, the Mastercraft Barefoot 200, the Ski-pro I/O with counter-rotating prop volvo power.

    True it's always been a small piece of the pie but the pie used to be bigger.
    Dave Ross--die cancer die
    escmanaze
  • Ralph LeeRalph Lee Posts: 492
    A lack of real men in the world today equals less everything manly. Including barefooting and slalom.
    escmanazeburdhntrswc5150
  • UWSkierUWSkier Posts: 1,363 Mega Baller
    Barefooters are definitely not extinct. At least not in Wisconsin. We see them all the time when we're out for early morning sets. They like us and we like them. Both go in straight lines and often share a common boat path making the smallest wakes possible.

    As Chuck said, none of the newer slalom plows are good barefoot boats when compared with the likes of the Sangers, pre Cut Diamond SV23 Malibus, etc.
    skibrain
  • bigskieridahobigskieridaho Posts: 939 Crazy Baller
    Bare footing=fun........and Advil:) small sport, but I see footers at the lake we go to as well. Any 40+ MPH boat will do just fine.
  • InthedayIntheday Posts: 142 Baller
    Quite a few open water barefooters, but fewer competitors and very few who compete in both "three event/slalom tournament" and barefoot. the ratio of barefooters to tournament skiers is I think is less than 10% and less than 1% who compete in both.

  • GregHindGregHind Posts: 348 Solid Baller

    ALPJr
  • WishWish Posts: 7,983 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    Still showing barefoot skiers at Lego Land FL (Formerly Cyprus Gardens). We were just there watching from our boat. They still get the biggest applause. And they were toed by a Wakeboard Nautique. Not sure which model (seemed small but engine in the back. And the guy started long line backwards and made a crazy sharp turn in rough condition. He has his man card for sure.





    There are 2 sets of bleachers. The other set, same size is where the show takes place...it was full.

    >>> 11.25..a different kettle of fish. <<<
    Ralph Lee
  • burdhntrburdhntr Posts: 34 Baller
    Definitely not dead. With the cost of boats these days, people are buying for wake/surf and slalom. You can easily use a slalom boat for barefooting. But to spend another $60,000 on a new "barefoot boat?!" Yeah. No.
  • DWDW Posts: 2,117 Mega Baller
    @escmanaze : I use a pylon for barefooting behind my boat, not much side pull so pylon works great and it gets stored away so no tower to deal with (personal preference not to have a tower for a variety of reasons). I do like the additional height for tumble turns & surface hops while footing. It is a bummer that only one manufacturer produces the boat of choice for footing these days.

    Commenting on footing's popularity or perhaps lack of in today's world, the one comment I hear quite a bit "I love surfing, it is so much easier on the body", and that is in reference to both footing and skiing. I thought that is what Advil was for.
    escmanaze
  • UWSkierUWSkier Posts: 1,363 Mega Baller
    Footstock is held about 5 miles from my lake every year. Not uncommon to see the world's best out on our lake for tune-ups in the run-up to the tourney.

    Those guys do annoy me though, with their figure-eight driving pattern...
    DW
  • escmanazeescmanaze Posts: 757 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    @UWskier so what boats are most common when the best in the world show up? Is everybody on a new sanger DXII or are the best footers in the world riding behind 20 year old boats?
  • escmanazeescmanaze Posts: 757 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    @burdhntr "you can easily use a slalom boat for barefooting" Those were my thoughts exactly, which is why I would have expected to see a ton more 200s out there where the guy is primarily a skier, so he buys a 200, but he also wants to barefoot, so he puts the 6.0 engine on it so that it can go 45 no problem with the gate up, and then puts the tower on it to get a higher tow point. I thought because of this, it would be really easy to find tons of 200s with big engines (that I need for elevation) and towers (that I need for wakeboarding and wakeskating) to be purchased from the guy who is hardcore slalom, but does barefoot as his chick on the side.

    However, I'm getting the message from most of these posts that I have totally misunderstood the footer demographic and that is why I'm not seeing the boats on the used market that I would have expected to see. Crazy that I knew so little about barefooters and who they are etc. I guess it makes sense though, as I have spent a lot of time on Utah lakes and the only person I've ever seen behind a boat without sticks is myself. I've literally never met "a barefooter" so I suppose that's probably why I don't understand their demographic very well.
  • GregHindGregHind Posts: 348 Solid Baller
    Barefoot boats these days also must have a boom. I've been told the chine spray off a 200 is terrible for footing. You can barefoot behind the current slalom sleds but they are as good for it as they are for wake boarding. Can be done but just not the tool for the job.
    I think there is a market for a modernised barefoot boat. Ideally that was really good for slalom and surf too. It wasn't long ago that there was no development left in slalom boats now look at them all.
    The old barefoot boats were really good and there was no reason offered to replace them.
  • swc5150swc5150 Posts: 2,349 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    @Wish
    That guy footing behind what appears to be a 210, is also proof that one doesn't need to go warp speed to barefoot. Still an image I never thought I'd see though! I'm glad they still have a ski show. Taking my family to Disney for Christmas, so hopefully the show is going on at the time.

    Steve Merritt taught me the proper speed to foot is body weight divided by 10, then add 20mph (with proper technique). Crashes aren't quite as brutal at 35mph for me, although I haven't "wasted" good water on footing in years.
    Scott Calderwood
  • escmanazeescmanaze Posts: 757 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    @scotchipman Well then I guess I have met a barefooter before. You're right, Kevin has that super classic foot boat in his shop all the time. However, whenever I try to get him to talk about skiing, the club, the glory days etc. he seems pretty reluctant to go there, so I've never really gotten much out of him along those lines.
  • wtrskiorwtrskior Posts: 704 Crazy Baller
    If you are a slalomer and a footer The response lxr would be a great option. Not as great a table as the old response or the sporty but a very nice boat for all 3 disciplines.

    I see a guy footing from a 200 boom often. Spray doesn't seem to bother him but he's fairly novice.

    I haven't gone barefoot into in a few years, but for many years when I was younger it's all I wanted to do. Lack of a well protected slalom course on a large public lake with many coves meant finding good footing water was usually easier.

    The flightcrafts are still very popular for footers. All composite construction on later models- if maintained well, should last many years. Easy to throw a new 200 on one, not cheap though... new Motor worth way more than the hull now.
  • ZmanZman Posts: 1,585 Mega Baller
    Wow, such pickiness for barefoot boats. Guess we are a bit the same for slalom these days. Many of us started footing behind whatever we could tie a rope to. I learned behind a 4 cylinder Mercruiser I/O, 170 HP, 18 foot OB pleasure boat. Had to butt ride quite a while until it almost reached max speed of 36. At 160 to 170 that was plenty. One foots were a little harder, but still doable.
    @swc5150 Took 4 or 5 days of lessons from Steve Merritt back in the early 80's in Lantana. He taught me the back deeps and a few other moves.
  • 6balls6balls Posts: 5,329 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    Passionate footers care just as much about boat performance and wake as we ballers care about slalom wake..but it's different. Who runs deep shortline on a Sanger DXII? It's not that you can't they track like monsters and the barefoot specific wake is the bomb...but the slalom wake is small and hard...not ideal.
    Who among the tourney barefoot crowd runs just any boat that runs 40 plus? Nautique??? Love 'em for slalom but barefoot wake is not great.
    For recreational footers no big deal...go 40, step off or deep start, do some tumble-turns n one foots and if the wake is not ideal no biggie. For the tourney/competitive footing crowd they want more.
    Dave Ross--die cancer die
    Zman
  • Fam-manFam-man Posts: 198 Solid Baller
    edited April 2017
    We barefoot with my brother in laws G21. Bought it specifically with the big motor so it would do 40.
    The wake crossing involves a bit of a step up but it's doable. As mentioned by others, all about fun
  • swc5150swc5150 Posts: 2,349 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    @Zman
    Steve's a great guy and teacher. I was actually good friend's with his brother Scott in my youth.
    Scott Calderwood
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