WhisperFin unboxing

HortonHorton Posts: 32,945 Administrator

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Comments

  • ricorico Posts: 412 Crazy Baller
    @Horton when are you trying this?
    Eric Francois - Studio City, CA - Denali C-85 - Reflex
  • 6balls6balls Posts: 6,201 Mega Baller
    I have devices on the leading edge of the airplane wing...they make a huge difference in laminar flow at high angles of attack. Dropped the take off and landing speed, way more control in the flare, and basically the wing is now un-stall-able.
    I love the idea of applying this to fin tech. You go Jay! Awesome book I hope the fin works out awesome, too.
    Dave Ross--die cancer die
    ScottScott
  • SkiJaySkiJay Posts: 2,314 Mega Baller
    @6balls
    Exactly! We used to use zigzag tape as turbulators on our competition sailplane wings, and the glide ratio would improve remarkably. It seems counterintuitive that creating turbulence can actually reduce drag, but that's how the turbulator slots on this fin work.
    www.FinWhispering.com ... Your ski should be your dance partner, not a wrestling opponent
    MISkierscotchipmanJordan
  • ZmanZman Posts: 1,971 Mega Baller
    An interesting article from 1987 where grooves, or "riblets" were applied to the Stars and Stripes hull to help it win the America's Cup. The purpose was to reduce drag by smoothing the turbulence of the water as it passes the hull.

    3M Riblets

    I had been wondering if this is also the concept behind the Goode gold fin that has grooves machined into the surface in the direction of flow.
  • skialexskialex Posts: 1,420 Mega Baller
    This is really interesting
    APB
  • WishWish Posts: 8,604 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    @SkiJay how did u land on the size and location of the unique hole patterns?. Must be more then trial and error yes??
    >>> 11.25..a different kettle of fish. <<<
  • DangerBoyDangerBoy Posts: 477 Crazy Baller
    @SkiJay are there right and left foot forward versions of your fin or just one fin for both orientations? And what about a wing? Is there no need for a wing on this fin? If so, why?
    I can take anything apart
  • SkiJaySkiJay Posts: 2,314 Mega Baller
    @scotchipman There are no formal arrangements with any ski manufacturers at this point, but I'm open to the idea.
    www.FinWhispering.com ... Your ski should be your dance partner, not a wrestling opponent
  • BrewskiBrewski Posts: 474 Crazy Baller
    edited December 2018
    300 for a fin seams a bit ludicrous but if need balls.........
  • kckc Posts: 371 Crazy Baller
    @SkiJay I see in the ordering information that you have listed each of the major ski brands individually, with all but Radar at a thickness of .095 inches, and Radar at .080 inches. Is there actually a different fin for each of the brands, or is it just thickness, in other words are the Connelly and D3 fins identical?
  • DavidNDavidN Posts: 613 Crazy Baller
    edited December 2018
    I‘m also interested in what’s @kc bringing up above, about different fins for different ski manufacturers.
    A D3 fin for example won't fit a 2018 Connely GT with the Viper 2.0 fin box. The mounting holes are placed slightly different and the set screws are not in the exact same location. Even the 2017 GT fin is different from the 2018 model. For a $300 piece I sure wouldn’t want to have it to file down or drill additional holes to get it to fit my fin box.
    I would be interested in a fin for a 2018 KD Platinum, but you can’t select the option “KD” on your website.
  • ToddFToddF Posts: 604 Solid Baller
    I was excited until I saw the price. Sorry to say :/
    I usually get a different ski every two years and a lot of times they are different brands, so I would like to know I could keep the fin and swap it to each ski.
  • HortonHorton Posts: 32,945 Administrator
    Not to speak for Jay but generally, it's not a big deal to swap fins between brands.

    Support BallOfSpray by supporting the companies that support BallOfSpray

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  • AkBobAkBob Posts: 50 Baller
    When can we order one and how long before we can actually get one to try? Also,will this fin work best with a standard wing or do you have something available that is better?
  • BraceMakerBraceMaker Posts: 5,341 Mega Baller
    @Brewski While it seems expensive, it also is probably too inexpensive vs. the costs of filing and maintaining a patent!

    A_m [email protected]
    Than_BoganBG1Brewski
  • SkiJaySkiJay Posts: 2,314 Mega Baller
    @kc, @DavidN & @ToddF
    There are two thicknesses, .080" and .095". I broke it down by brand for my own records. The fin profiles are identical in every regard.

    The profile along the top of the fin is designed to work in all of the current common fin blocks, including the new Connelly Viper design. Additionally, the prototype fins were all .080" and they worked fine in every ski listed. So if you want one fin to work in all skis, choose the .080" thickness.

    FWIW, Bruce Dodd set a Men's 6 national record last month using a .080" fin in a Goode which normally uses the thickest fin.
    www.FinWhispering.com ... Your ski should be your dance partner, not a wrestling opponent
    scotchipmanBG1
  • HortonHorton Posts: 32,945 Administrator
    @skijay in your testing did you spend much time on comparing the two thicknesses of fins on identical skis with identical settings?

    Support BallOfSpray by supporting the companies that support BallOfSpray

    Connelly ☆Denali ☆Goode ☆ HO Syndicate MasterCraft ☆ Masterline ☆ Performance Ski and Surf ☆ 

    Reflex ☆ Radar ☆ Rodics OffCourse ☆ S Lines ☆ Stokes ☆

  • SkiJaySkiJay Posts: 2,314 Mega Baller
    @AkBob
    You can preorder one now at: https://WhisperFin.com. I'm expecting to have fin's within six weeks, and will be filling orders on a first come first serve basis.
    www.FinWhispering.com ... Your ski should be your dance partner, not a wrestling opponent
  • SkiJaySkiJay Posts: 2,314 Mega Baller
    @Wish & @Brewski
    There was a LOT of research into fish, whales, exotic sailboat keels, rudders, etc., plus aerodynamic studies since air and water are both fluids. But I had to draw the line at renting hydrodynamic test tank time before these fins ended up costing more than skis. In the end, applying what I'd learned to ski fins took a mountain of experimental fins, the help of a wide range of skiers on a variety of ski brands and a torn hamstring on the prime crash-test dummy. It has not been a cheap or frivolous project, and the size and shape of every hole in this fin is the way it is for a reason.
    www.FinWhispering.com ... Your ski should be your dance partner, not a wrestling opponent
  • SkiJaySkiJay Posts: 2,314 Mega Baller
    @Horton Not yet on this fin, though I've done that in the past with standard fins. The real reason I'm offering two thicknesses has more to do with longevity than performance. With the exception of Goode, only the top tabs of the fin mount into the fin block, and the bottom edge of most fin blocks forms a sharp edge. If the ski's fin slot is much wider than the fin, the fin can flex side to side along the red line illustrated below until it cracks. It takes a long long time, but it happens. We don't want that.




    www.FinWhispering.com ... Your ski should be your dance partner, not a wrestling opponent
  • SkiJaySkiJay Posts: 2,314 Mega Baller
    You may or may not be surprised that I have all of these dimensions from all of the skis listed on my website. And because I've done this homework, I can say with confidence that the only ski that has a fin slot too wide for the .080" Radar version is the Connelly. Though the .095" is recommended, the .080" thin version should be fine in all of the other skis listed too if you prefer the feel of a thinner fin, or may use your fin in a Radar in the future.
    www.FinWhispering.com ... Your ski should be your dance partner, not a wrestling opponent
    schaferbaja
  • HortonHorton Posts: 32,945 Administrator
    edited December 2018
    @SkiJay I actually have quite a bit to say on the subject of thickness but I'm going to dig up an old thread and make those comments there so I don't derail this thread. I will say that my entire career in the waterskiing industry started because of the thickness durability issue you stated above.

    Support BallOfSpray by supporting the companies that support BallOfSpray

    Connelly ☆Denali ☆Goode ☆ HO Syndicate MasterCraft ☆ Masterline ☆ Performance Ski and Surf ☆ 

    Reflex ☆ Radar ☆ Rodics OffCourse ☆ S Lines ☆ Stokes ☆

  • JetsetrJetsetr Posts: 497 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    edited December 2018
    deleted
  • Mick04Mick04 Posts: 63 Baller
    edited December 2018
    .
  • HortonHorton Posts: 32,945 Administrator
    this is not a class in rudimentary aircraft design. Please try to get back on topic

    Support BallOfSpray by supporting the companies that support BallOfSpray

    Connelly ☆Denali ☆Goode ☆ HO Syndicate MasterCraft ☆ Masterline ☆ Performance Ski and Surf ☆ 

    Reflex ☆ Radar ☆ Rodics OffCourse ☆ S Lines ☆ Stokes ☆

    ZmanWishMick04
  • bajabaja Posts: 251 Baller
    @SkiJay Thank you so much for the thousands of hours you have dedicated over the years to unravelling the voodoo magic of fins and deciphering and documenting the science behind them. So of course it is no surprise that you have the accurate fitment measurements to most common skis, fins and fin boxes... and CAD drawings... and now you are designing a better mousetrap for the benefit of a sport that is smaller than curling... and sharing your knowledge and technology. Thank you.
    Bruce_ButterfieldSkiJay6ballsWaterSkier12
  • KRoundyKRoundy Posts: 657 Crazy Baller
    Wow! That looks amazing.
    Can I use the standard wing that came with my Radar Senate, or will the fin come with a new type-specific wing? It is plainly obvious that there is another hole right behind and above where the wing appears to live. I usually don't ski until about April up here in Washington (Seattle), so I have a LOT of time to wonder what the 2019 ski season will bring with these new fin technologies!
  • 6balls6balls Posts: 6,201 Mega Baller
    @SkiJay why is no caliper needed to adjust? Is the fin relatively insensitive to adjustments?
    Dave Ross--die cancer die
  • jercranejercrane Posts: 393 Crazy Baller
    @SkiJay Will you provide suggested "stock" settings for various skis when you start delivering these? I'm kind of curious how DFT will be measured. I imagine the settings could be vastly different than a stock fin? perhaps?
    Gloersen
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