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Thoughts and options on rear Hardshell

Orlando76Orlando76 Posts: 1,073 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
Is Reflex the only one who makes a rear Hardshell? Is that my only option? I’m on a Syndicate Hardshell front and looking for something on the rear.

Comments

  • BlueSkiBlueSki Posts: 684 Crazy Baller
    As far as I know. I have had luck with it and run the upper cuff loose on Adam Caldwell’s suggestion. If you run the foot tight and the top loose it is a bit like an R-style with a release mechanism. You can gradually loosen the cuff over time to aid in the adjustment if you are used to something snug.
    jimski
  • Ed_JohnsonEd_Johnson Posts: 2,118
    Love the Reflex R-Style Rear. Been on it several years now, coming off decades of Double Hardshells. Holds my foot in place, gives a greater range of movement, and always releases.

    Special Thanks to Performance Ski and Surf and the Denali Adam's !!!
    aupatkingski6jones
  • Orlando76Orlando76 Posts: 1,073 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    edited August 10
    @Ed_Johnson I bought an R style 3 weeks ago. Used it once. For the umphteenth time I’ve learned I can’t give up a binding. Bummer because I had high hopes.

    BTW, size 12 R style for sale or trade. 2019, carbon plate
  • mmosley899mmosley899 Posts: 599 Water Ski Industry Professional
    @Orlando76 what do you mean by a rear hardshell? A rear boot or a rear release system? There are multiple options for both.
    Mike's Overall Binding www.mobsystemrelease.com
    Sweet Home Alabama Skiing
    Senior Judge, Senior Driver, Tech Controller
  • Ed_JohnsonEd_Johnson Posts: 2,118
    edited August 10
    @Orlando76 ..... A trick I learned from Andy Mapple, who talked me into the R-Style to begin with, to improve COM Movement, was...take a Regular Liner from your Hardshell, and place a Velcro strap tight around the top. It will fool your brain into believing it is still in a full boot. That trick still works for me today..Guess it's easy to fool my brain !!!

    As far as selling your R-Style, is it Left or Right Foot, and how much did you want?

    Special Thanks to Performance Ski and Surf and the Denali Adam's !!!
    Orlando76T_C
  • Orlando76Orlando76 Posts: 1,073 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    edited August 10
    @mmosley899 yes, im looking for a hard shell with a release for the rear. I’m on a new syndicate hard shell with release on the front, so I don’t want to give that up, yet. Can I put just an MOB on the rear and not interfere with the front release of the HO?

    @Ed_Johnson I may try putting a strap on my ankle. The part I feel I need is something to fool the back side of my heel at the ball. With the Rstyle I evidently lift enough to where the heel ball doesn’t have anything pressing against it. The Rstyle I have is a lefty. Price depends on whether or not I can use the liner from the Rstyle with the white cuff reflex. I say white cuff reflex as I’m guessing that’s my only option.
  • BlueSkiBlueSki Posts: 684 Crazy Baller
    Your liner will make a big difference in feel. Before you give up on the r-style, try an intuition liner with a strap. It probably won’t be wasted either way because if you go to the reflex rear, you will probably want intuition liners anyway.
    Orlando76
  • DaveLemonsDaveLemons Posts: 26 Baller
    So If you buy a new ski do you only try it once before giving up on it. You say you’ve only tried the r style once. I don’t know if anyone who switches bindings and immediately runs a PB. Give it some time and play with how tight you have it on top of your foot
    davestaxidermystudio.com
  • Orlando76Orlando76 Posts: 1,073 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    @DaveLemons No. I’ve tried a kicker many times in the past for 1-2 month stints with no luck. When I switched to the Rstyle it performed like a kicker just customizable fit on top of my foot. Glorified rear toe strap.
  • JordanJordan Posts: 1,175 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    edited August 10
    There are skiers using double Goode Powershells. (Regina for example)

    There are also some skiers who use double Reflex hardshells. I think Pigozzi does.

    arthurmrmusic
  • jtompkins120jtompkins120 Posts: 7 New Baller
    Fluid motion makes a rear hard shell as well...I use an old system called fogmans that are two hard shells mounted to a plate that releases from the ski...I love it and wish more manufacturers make something like it. I also think MOB mikes overall binding makes something similar
  • BrewskiBrewski Posts: 415 Crazy Baller
    KOHENS
  • aupatkingaupatking Posts: 1,289 Mega Baller
    @Brewski what ever happened with those? Seemed like there was a fair amount of hope that those would somehow come to market
    Brewski
  • ghutchghutch Posts: 94 Baller
    I have an R style rear for sale. I'm a 10.5 with an Intuition liner. Left foot
  • BraceMakerBraceMaker Posts: 3,801 Mega Baller
    @aupatking he'll probably accommodate you if you want to buy one ;)

    Tons of option for rear hardshells if you want to switch from your front boot. You could do dual MOB dual FM Dual Goode, you could buy a used system from Fogman or Connelly.

    To keep your front you could also get an FM revo-z rear which would be more secure than a r-style.
    Orlando76
  • jimskijimski Posts: 406 Solid Baller
    @Orlando76
    I use the double reflex. White cuff in the rear.
    I tried the r style but it just didn’t give me the support I was looking for.
    If you look at the buckles on the R they are quite a bit lower on the foot and I think this takes away from the heal support.
    I also do what @BlueSki does and leave the top buckle loose with a tall liner.
    I’m at the point now where I could even take the white cuff off the boot and ski with just the bottom of the shell for a little more flexibility.
    BlueSki
  • skialexskialex Posts: 909 Crazy Baller
    @Orlando76 I’m not a big fun of the double hard shell with separate release system. In my opinion there is a big chance that one would release and the other not. I believe that the safest setup for Reflex type front system is a RTP rear or next best thing a R-style type. I like the suggestion of using an intuition liner with a Velcro strap and was thinking that you could also take a cuff off another hard shell and put it over your ankle. I think if the cuff stays in place it could simulate a full rear hardshell but release like an R-style.
  • BrewskiBrewski Posts: 415 Crazy Baller
    edited August 12
    @aupatking I still ski on them and LOVE them. The greatest and safest feel ever. IMHO. @BraceMaker THANKS~!

    I have a few sets of plates, being they are all custom they are not a simple thing to make. I have been on this set since 2014. Very little sign of wear. Absolute perfect edge control. I was supposed to go to Orlando and work with Andy at his new shop but due to his demise that never happened. Still would love to work with a manufacture to build a better boot~!::::::::~~~~~~~
  • BrewskiBrewski Posts: 415 Crazy Baller
    edited August 12
    @skialex I thought the same thing but the release mechanisms are really not that tight. I did tons of testing, when one goes they both go.....+ on a custom boot you really don't even have to tighten the rear boot at all. I have had my rear foot come out with out either release activating.
    skialexBlueSki
  • BlueSkiBlueSki Posts: 684 Crazy Baller
    @skialex, I also used to think the same thing, but now after using the double release I have to respectfully disagree on the chances of only one releasing, those odds are probably pretty low. Although anything is possible, I had more than one fall when the r-style did not release like the front and one of those cost me a season (so I am admittedly biased). There is also a picture around of Whitney McClintock falling and her ski is only on one foot, the one in the r-style. I attribute this to different levels of force and direction with different release approaches. Anytime that I have had a release from my double reflex, which are identical in the means of release, both have released almost simultaneously... hopefully that continues.

    No system is perfectly safe and we just don’t have a good data set beyond the anecdotal to determine what is the safest. The r-style probably provides greater performance to the masses, and I would not discourage one of my kids from using one if that is what they wanted. Given how well the r-style works and the success of the Reflex system, I think both rear options are probably fairly comparable in safety, but we can’t be certain.
    jimskiBrewskiskialex
  • mmosley899mmosley899 Posts: 599 Water Ski Industry Professional
    @Orlando76 @skialex I skied on a double hardshell MOB type release system for twenty years, never had only one foot release. The HO system does not release in multiple directions like the MOB system does, so putting the MOB release on with that type could lead to problems. The double boot MOB release system is the safest system available.

    I changed to a half boot rear style binding a couple of years ago. Only took a few sets to get comfortable to it. I have had no problems with any releases, however my rear is cut much lower than the Reflex R style. Also I do not over tighten the buckles. My rear liner is also cut low. You should not need to feel like there is anything around your ankle.
    Mike's Overall Binding www.mobsystemrelease.com
    Sweet Home Alabama Skiing
    Senior Judge, Senior Driver, Tech Controller
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