Help with my wife's ski or skiing

CamCam Posts: 316 Solid Baller
edited October 2010 in Technique & Theory
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At the start of the season I was sure my wife would be running the course this year but now the season is almost over she doesn't seem to be any further on.
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We got a good deal on a 64" Blue Fisher (she is 5'1" 115 lbs), I thought it would be too advanced for her but she tried it and seemed to ski better on it than her 67" HO Triumph.
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I watched her from the boat last week and thought that the ski could be holding her back as sometimes it turned too fast and then she would just flatten it off and loose all her angle.
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I don't know if I should try to detune the ski or try to get her back onto a more forgiving ski whhich she is not keen on doing, obviously we will still be working on her basics.
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I have put this video on You Tube any advice would be appreciated
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<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZM94XuwmR8"><font color="#0066cc">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZM94XuwmR8</font></a>
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Cam
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Comments

  • rq0013rq0013 Posts: 551 Baller
     I would say the ski might be hurting her. It might be just too aggressive for those slow speeds. Its like putting her on a Goode, not very forgiving. She might need a little extra width on the ski to generate some speed.  My girl friend looked just like that and was running the course the same wasy. i put her on a 65" Radar lyric and she liked the way it turned and the balance it had. After 2 seasons on it she is moving to a senate C. The skis is for sale $125 shipped.
    Rob Quetschke
  • bxroadsbxroads Posts: 219
    <p>
    Like kfennell, I was recently in this stage myself.  I've improved dramatically by getting out of the course and working on drills.  Like fennell said, hips up, hips up, hips up.  Easier said than done.    Run the boat through the course but have her pull outside the balls and stay outside the balls down the length of the course in a hips up, pull position.  Repeat, repeat, repeat on both sides until she's comfortable in a good pulling position.  Once she's comfortable in the position have her start just outside the wake and pull out wide (not crossing the wake), repeat, repeat, repeat.  Do this on each side until she feels comfortable pulling out and is in a good position.  When all of this starts to click have her pull accross the wake.  Start just outside the white water and pull to the end of the white water on the other side of the wake.   I learned that the pull behind the boat is like dribbling a basketball, there are hundreds of different techniques to work on but until you can dribble there's no sense to work on a running jumper. 
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  • mopowpowmopowpow Posts: 318 Baller
    When I was learning to ski the course, I put my binding forward of the recommended setting.  That might help her stay more centered over the ski.  Us girls usually have a little more 'junk in the trunk' than men, and because of the lower center of gravity, tend to ride the ski more tail-heavy than men.  But I also agree with the others that working on drills & keeping her hips up in a more centered position would help a lot.
  • CamCam Posts: 316 Solid Baller
    Believe it or not we have been trying to work on all of the above especially hips up and weight on the front foot and the bindings are all the way forward.
    She did ski well at ski school in Spain in June and consistently ran 5 buoys without the gates, but expected to do the same when she got home and got frustrated when she couldn't and she lost her confidence which we have been slowly building back up.
    I know she doesn't want to down grade her ski but I also know that if I hadn't moved to a top end ski when I was running the course at 26mph I would have improved a lot quicker and not be left with a lot of bad habits.
    Thanks for the input
    Cam
  • Than_BoganThan_Bogan Posts: 6,346 Mega Baller
    edited October 2010
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    My first thought is that ski is too small (in bottom surface area) for that speed.  She's riding so deep in the water that she really has to work to get it to turn and to accelerate behind the boat.
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    To be clear, I am NOT NOT NOT saying to go faster.  The slowest speed you can tolerate is always where to start.  But my guess is a ski with more surface area (longer and/or wider) would be a LOT more comfortable.
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    All the technique points above are obviously valid, but I think there's a missing level of comfort before she can really address them.
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    I would be cautious about moving the bindings forward.  I do not find that this move actually gets the skier closer to the right stance -- in fact often the opposite.  The bindings far forward makes it feel very comfortable to rock back and put all the weight on the rear foot -- exactly what you DON'T want to do.  And feels like you'll sink the tip if you pressure the front foot, which is exactly what you DO want to do.
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    Nathaniel Bogan -- GUT Padawan
  • HO 410HO 410 Posts: 351 Baller
    You have to be in the ballpark to compare skis. That Fisher felt better than the Triumph because anything smaller would have felt better. I can't see the clip right now, but the responses make it sound like she's skiing very defensively. I would shelf the Fisher and go with something like a Radar Lyric. It will be better for slower speeds and will not be so critical of her technique. Blame the ski, the new one should give a mental breath or fresh air.
    Nikon D80, 50mm f 1.8, Tokina 12-24mm... Sorry, wrong forum. Josh T.
  • lpskierlpskier Posts: 2,466 Mega Baller
    I can't keep my hips up. I can keep my chest through my arms. Maybe that will help. Also, as a general rule, a spouse is not a good coach.
    John Wilkins- Si non pro sanguine quem ludus ne. #iskiconnelly
  • skirayskiray Posts: 173 Baller
    Cam, let me start with good luck.  It is very hard to coach a spouse. The right ski is critical and the previous comments are all over that.  I do have one question, do you work with her much on land?  I know that is old school, but it really help my wife.  We tried a single handle on a pole or trailer hitch.  I took video of her position and we discussed.  Then we did the same thing with a rope abut 20' long on a pole, hitch or tree.  I got her to lean away in a confortable position, then I would push down on the middle of the rope and try to pull her up or out of position.  (like a tug a war)  It took some trial and error, but she got a better feel for what position worked for her. (maximum strength and maintaining balance weight on both feet.)  It may sound crazy, but it is easy to do.  Besides it is something you can wor on in the off season.
    Ron Ray
  • skirayskiray Posts: 173 Baller
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    This is skiray's wife. He left himself logged in :)  What he said really did help me out a lot!  Also, I really focused on strength training last winter and it just helped me feel more in control of the ski.  Hard to explain, but this spring I came out of the gate feeling like I was able to control the ski versus just having to react to what was happening.  I would also have to agree though that a 3rd party is often a BIG help escpecially when I feel like I'm doing all I can and still not getting it right.  It's just easier to hear that from someone else.  Best of luck to you!  I love to hear of other families skiing together!  And, sometimes I just take a break from working on the course and ski open water just to remember what I loved about the sport to start with... slalom skiing - the sport you love to hate!
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    Ron Ray
  • CamCam Posts: 316 Solid Baller
    We are going out for a couple of sets this afternoon and I will try to get her on a more forgiving ski for the 2nd set and see how it goes.

    We have a handle set up in the garage and when she leans on it her position looks OK, nothing like her on the water position, but I will definitely try the tug of war thing with her and yes I think she could do with some strength training.

    As for coaching I am just taking an interest at the end of the season (I know the pitfalls after trying to teach her to drive a car many years ago), but she normally skis with the other coaches and her friend at our ski site, my on the water input is probably about 10% but I do try to talk about it off the water, would probably help if she was more of a ski geek like me.

    We had planned to do a lot of free skiing this summer but that fell through due to the reliability of the boat at the club we were going to do some extra skiing at, but they are getting a newer boat for next season so fingers crossed we can get more quality water time next year.
  • CamCam Posts: 316 Solid Baller
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    Couldn't get a hold of the ski I wanted to try her on so she had 2 sets on the Fisher, 1st one was as usual although she said she was trying to get off her back foot and get her hips up.
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    In between sets we decided to get a rope and handle out and practice her position on it, she agreed that if everyone on BOS was criticising her body position she would have to try to work on it, she also took more of an interest in watching other skiers her level and above and even commented on how my line and width into buoy 1 is so much different from hers.
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    2nd set she was so much better and didn't let her hips drop back once, I had someone else in the boat who agreed she looked a lot better getting more speed and less bounce through the wakes on her offside.

    Bottom line is she came off the water buzzing and can't wait to ski again.
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    Thanks

    Cam
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  • h2odawg79h2odawg79 Posts: 599 Baller
    <p>
    Cam, without getting Long winded here all that I will say is, some Keys to progression are:
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    Freeski when implementing changes, drilling or trying to groove something into habit. ( work the course sparingly)
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    Use video and encourage (complement, Look for the Good stuff) MUCH, much more then criticize.
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    Shadow Balls. Go around 1,3,5 and shadow 2,4,6 for a couple sets. then, go around 2,4,6 and shadow 1,3,5 for a couple sets, etc... (this will help develope rhythm and course awareness)
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    The smallest victory and  pat on the Back can sometimes be HUGE!<img src="http://www.ballofspray.com/vanillaforum/js/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-smile.gif" border="0" alt="Smile" title="Smile" />
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    The smallest defeat and well intentioned critique can also be HUGE...<img src="http://www.ballofspray.com/vanillaforum/js/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-frown.gif" border="0" alt="Frown" title="Frown" />  
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    HOO HAW! thankya very much
  • Than_BoganThan_Bogan Posts: 6,346 Mega Baller
    Sage advice, Mr. Dawg, especially the two points at the end.
    Nathaniel Bogan -- GUT Padawan
  • Chuck_DickeyChuck_Dickey Posts: 1,459 Crazy Baller
    Ski looks fine, her back leg too bent, front leg too straight. This puts all her weight on the tail of the ski. Get her to be more balanced by bending the front knee and ankle more while slightly straightening her rear knee. This will put her in a more hip forward position. Stress to her to get her hips forward. In the turns, she tends to sit on the tail and at the wake she is flattening the ski just before crossing. Standing a bit taller, push the hips forward and stay on edge throught he white water on the second wake and she's there!
  • h2odawg79h2odawg79 Posts: 599 Baller
    Thanx Than!<img src="http://www.ballofspray.com/vanillaforum/js/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-smile.gif" border="0" alt="Smile" title="Smile" /> -your a Good Man...
    HOO HAW! thankya very much
  • Than_BoganThan_Bogan Posts: 6,346 Mega Baller
    edited October 2010
    <p>
    As kind of a corrolary to what h20dawg79 mentioned, one thing that I think works pretty well for coaching almost anyone is what might be called "opposite to their emotional state."
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    I.e., when someone is riding high after an accomplishment, it's a lot easier for them to take some minor criticism.  "That was great, and the good news is you can be even better by X, Y, Z."
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    When someone is frustrated, it's probably more a time for encouragement than coaching.  "I know you're not satisifed with your skiing right now, but you are doing a great job with X, Y, Z -- focus on that and keep it up."
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    These aren't hard and fast rules, of course.
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    Nathaniel Bogan -- GUT Padawan
  • DWDW Posts: 1,968 Mega Baller
    Excellent comments above, I will add a suggestion.  One item I see is a shying away, or standing up at the wake, followed by a quick, short pull after the wake.  During the wake crossing there is limited shock absorption of the wake itself.  This is certainly not uncommon, and a big challenge to overcome, but the effect is a loss of angle and too much speed at the ball.  My suggestions to help would be to really use the knees as shock absorbers and as above get those hips up!  Certainly a challenge as with the reduced speed the wake is much taller/harder.  Good luck and have fun.

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