Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

12" White Stickers
BallOfSpray $5 Donation
BallOfSpray $10 Donation

SPEED & Outbound Swing // FREDDIE WINTER - FPM Podcast #6

ROBOTROBOT Posts: 330 Administrator
01100010 01100001 01101100 01101100 01101111 01100110 01110011 01110000 01110010 01100001 01111001


  • DanoDano Posts: 152 Baller
    Well done! So much good information in this video. The side by side of Fred and Nate was a great visual.
  • ClydesdaleClydesdale Posts: 171 Baller
    Wow-great discussion of my weakest link. Thanks Marcus & Freddie!
  • rq0013rq0013 Posts: 568 Solid Baller
    A topic I always want to learn more about and hear other's ideas and opinions. I think one aspect of swing that is key and not talked about as much, is whether or not the skier has created the "correct relationship" with the boat. I think the majority of us are being pulled by the boat rather than being free from the boat. I feel like if the skier is not free then the skier will be pulled to the inside at every ball with no space. Pro skiers create the relationship with the boat so easily. So how does a skier consistently "get free" so they can continue outbound off the second wake?
    Rob Quetschke
    jimskiballsohardStathis Ventouris
  • HortonHorton Posts: 30,170 Administrator
    @MarcusBrown funny what you said about free of the boat. I think of being free the boat as my ability to swing around the pylon with a tight line. Not being free of the boat means the boat is dragging me down the course ( like when my zero off was broken last Summer and the boat was getting perfect times but was not giving me any gas into the wakes)

    Support BallOfSpray by supporting the companies that support BallOfSpray

    Connelly ★DBSkis ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ Follow ★ Hobe Lake ★ MasterCraft

    Masterline ★ Performance Ski and Surf ★ Reflex ★ Radar ★ Stokes 

  • bsmithbsmith Posts: 88 Baller
    As a beginning course skier, my understanding of becoming free of the boat from everything I have read on BOS previously is that it happens at the end of the swing out before reaching apex and at about the same time I let go of the handle with the outside hand. It is the moment where I feel no pull from the boat such that is easy to let the ski turn inward towards the first wake.

    This is in contrast to when a beginner first tries the course and they pull long to a buoy and never get any glide time, free of the boat, before trying to make the ski turn back in. In this mode, the beginner feels a significant pull from the boat at all times.

    The beginner next learns that getting free of the boat is not just about obtaining some unloaded glide time towards the turn buoy, it is learning to get the right combination of speed across the wake with the right amount of deceleration to the buoy such that when the turn is initiated the skier still has enough speed to be free of the boat but not so much speed that the skier turns into a bunch of slack.

    This understanding of being free of the boat may be wrong, but it is what I think I have learned from BOS over the past year.
  • rq0013rq0013 Posts: 568 Solid Baller
    @MarcusBrown I understand the high-level concept you are talking about. Can expand on the controlling feet and handle movements? I think this is where the "meat is". When you say "move your feet too far out" is that in front of you, putting you more in a chair position or out to a more severe turning edge, tipping your hands and shoulders to the inside? Or could it be either. Are you saying as long as the skier has generated speed to centerline and not overloaded themselves, the longer they keep their handle and feet distance "close" through the transition, the higher on the boat they will ski? I sometimes feel i manage to keep my ski underneath me, not letting it shoot to a severe turning edge, but at the expense of a flatter ski and flatter path to the buoy. There seems to be a happy medium...
    Rob Quetschke
  • buoyboy1buoyboy1 Posts: 126 Baller
    @Marcus I may not be understanding you correctly when you stated that around 50 lbs of tension in the rope at/near each buoy. I would have thought that number to be a LOT less (like near zero) as many times just the tips of my fingers are on the handle at apex and/or the rope has so much slack it's in the water. Thanks and I look forward to more Podcasts.
  • bishop8950bishop8950 Posts: 1,210 Open or Level 9 Skier
    Thanks @MarcusBrown and @FWinter, great stuff.

    In my skiing over the last several years, improving how I move out past centerline has been the top priority. The light bulb went off that this is how I can run more buoys.

    As you discussed, there are many prerequisites that need to be in place to enable you to swing out and up. I would like to hear more about common themes or mindsets you describe to skiers to help them wrap their heads around this. Here are my top 3 examples that have helped me and all of which mentioned in your discussion:

    First, don’t try to get load as soon as you can off the buoy, you need to get fully under the line and allow the load to build on your way to the wake. After apex I tell myself “Wait for it...” and I try to ski as far as I can towards the first wake without the boat.

    Second, (credit @AdamCord and @adamhcaldwell) “stand up” through the transition”.

    Third (credit @matthewbrown) “make sure hips are over your feet”, not behind, as you swing through the transition.

    In this clip you also discuss “back arm pressure” which is huge.

    Any other keys to the right swing? What thought, goal or metric can I put in my head as I ski? I just want to go deeper down this rabbit hole. You guys have such a deep understand and also have analyzed so many skiers. Would love to hear more on this and this video format of the discussion is really effective.
  • HortonHorton Posts: 30,170 Administrator
    @MarcusBrown I jumped in those days. Imagine how perplexing that was.

    Support BallOfSpray by supporting the companies that support BallOfSpray

    Connelly ★DBSkis ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ Follow ★ Hobe Lake ★ MasterCraft

    Masterline ★ Performance Ski and Surf ★ Reflex ★ Radar ★ Stokes 

  • jimskijimski Posts: 588 Crazy Baller
    @MarcusBrown any video of this athletic position
    Who does it the best that you have seen
Sign In or Register to comment.