Goode double boot dual lock pre-release

jeidmannjeidmann Posts: 37 Baller
edited April 23 in Skis Fins Bindings
First set second day of the season, scraping off some rust at 34/22, I had an equipment failure with the Dual Lock yesterday morning. My neck is a little stiff but it could have been a worse. The wake is pretty hard on this old Malibu and the water was 65 degrees.

I really like the double boots, but this has been my biggest reservation about the using the Goode double boot setup - a dual lock pre-release. I’ve watched and followed Dave Miller’s video on setting up and mounting the plate and I’m meticulous about checking my equipment before I ski. A Pro slalom friend recommended 3 or 4 strips of 400 tape across the front. I was wondering if any of you had any experience/advise on the setup ( I completely understand that, for liability reasons, whatever I do regarding the setup is my own responsibility…I’m just looking for insight.), I never want to pre-release like this again, I guess this is why some people resort to screwing down their plate.

https://youtu.be/06B_E4N957I


Comments

  • jeidmannjeidmann Posts: 37 Baller
    Forgot to mention....video is linked at the bottom of the post.
  • HortonHorton Posts: 32,350 Administrator
    that video is so awesome! do it again! do it again!

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  • klindyklindy Posts: 2,898 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    “3 or 4 strips of 400 across the front”? First that looks like the release started from the rear so what’s on the front is less important. But 3M does NOT recommend using 400/400. In other words do you have 400 on the ski meshing with 400 on the plate? If so, that’s a no-no. The little pegs are so dense, since they are same size, they apparently don’t mesh well. See this link

    https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/dual-lock-reclosable-fasteners-us/
    Keith Lindemulder
    AWSA Chairman of the Board

  • Bruce_ButterfieldBruce_Butterfield Posts: 2,168 Member of the BallOfSpray Hall Of Fame
    edited April 23
    @jeidmann I don't think you will find many fans of dual lock on this board or in the wider waterski community. It is an extremely poor release mechanism as you have found out the hard way. When the dual lock concept first came out, I had the heel come up on me at 1 ball in a tournament. After that, I screwed the plate to the ski. If you not comfortable screwing the plate to the ski, I would strongly recommend you go to a Reflex or MOB configuration as soon as you can.

    Oh yeah, that is an awesome video!
    I'm Ancient. WTH do I know?
    jeidmannZman
  • AndreAndre Posts: 1,786 Mega Baller
    edited April 23
    Velcro: good for gloves.
    Edit: Ouch!!!
    My ski finish in 16.95 ...but my ass is out of tolerance!
  • aupatkingaupatking Posts: 1,784 Mega Baller
    Nothing good to say about that boot setup/system other than, when you’re skiing, it’s fantastic! When you fall, it is an ER trip waiting to happen. It has fundamental flaws. My buddy tried some 400 due to prereleases and broke his Tib and Fib because it didn’t release. I had it setup EXACTLY like Goode used to recommend and broke my Talus in a fall that would have been a total snoozer in ANYTHING else.
    There are others who have used it for years and will totally disagree, but I’m not risking another broken bone for their opinion
    jeidmann
  • aupatkingaupatking Posts: 1,784 Mega Baller
    Did your spotter say Down, or DAMN!!! :p
    Zman
  • jeidmannjeidmann Posts: 37 Baller
    Horton, I'm glad I could return the favor and be a source of entertainment... ; )
  • jeidmannjeidmann Posts: 37 Baller
    Bruce, a big factor for me in considering the dual lock was talking to Todd Kuykendall, he's been very happy with it.
    I would definitely prefer screwing down the plate to having this happen again. I previously was using Radar boots and wore them so snug I never came out of them and didn't have any injuries.
    I've looked at the MOB, could still result in a pre-release if not adjusted tight enough, I'll look again. What setup do you use?
  • LeonLLeonL Posts: 2,720 Crazy Baller
    Several years ago a story floated around. Seems a skier was seated on a plane and a conversation arose with the guy seated next to him. Turns out the guy was an engineer with dual lock. The skier says "hey, I use that to attach my bindings allowing for release." The engineer was appalled and said that stuff was never designed for such a use.
    Leon Leonard Stillwater Lake KY - SR Driver SR Judge
  • NameUnavailableNameUnavailable Posts: 46 Baller
    I had that happen thru the gates. It was like a cartoon where the tire from your car comes off and you see it pass you...I saw the ski then realized it was soon going to hurt...then I put a strip of the 250 on the outside edge of the plate it never happened again.
  • GloersenGloersen Posts: 1,231 Mega Baller
    riding the tail is not always safer.
    link to old thread may be of interest.
    https://ballofspray.com/forum#/discussion/comment/43900
    there's a limit on the # of neck scorpions in one lifetime.

    skialexskiboyny
  • ski41off_daveski41off_dave Posts: 7 Open or Level 9 Skier
    Hey give me a call I can help. Dave Miller 604 768 3800
    jeidmann
  • NaterNater Posts: 28 Baller
    edited April 24
    @Gloersen is correct!! I was about to post the same picture or a slowed down video of your front plate separating and then slapping back down. If you turn up the volume you can hear this slapping or clicking noise as well. I’ve experienced this before when during my set I kept hearing a click click noise going through the wake. I skied a few passes hearing this noise then let go after hearing it again heading from one to two. I reviewed the end course video we keep running all summer. I saw this same image of the front plate separating and slapping back down. I still use this set up and keep a close Eye on things and also have added a few short strips of either 250 or 400 in the front center. This is certainly NOT a recommendation. It’s just what I have done.
    * picture from my end course video…



  • richfosterrichfoster Posts: 126 Baller
    As far as performance I think the power shells are hard to beat. I used them for five years, but I just got tired of maintaining the dual lock. Also I was at a tournament 8+ hours drive from home.On Sunday they offered the turn and burn option for rounds two and three. I crashed second round(with release). It delayed me getting home by two hours. That was the final straw.
  • Alberto SoaresAlberto Soares Posts: 368 Solid Baller
    Do yourself a favor and buy a reflex / r-style, it will be lot cheaper than the hospital bill
    AndreaupatkingMastercrafterPatM
  • AndersonAnderson Posts: 62 Baller
    I loved my Power Shells and used them for almost 10 years (using various lengths/types of tape). Favorite feeling boots of anything I have tried before or since, but the pre-releases just aren't worth it. My system would pre-release about once a season, but the crashes were brutal. Not worth it. I switched to Reflex/R-style, and while I don't like the boots as much as my Power Shells, the only thing I have to worry about now is the occasional bite from the Reflex snake on my back shin if I fall hard. Much better than the nearly certain, but unpredictable, yard sale on my Power Shells that left me laying in the water wondering if my limbs were still attached and uncertain which direction was up vs. down. I was stubborn -- I wish I had made the change sooner. Good luck!
    Bruce_Butterfield
  • JordanJordan Posts: 1,291 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    Does anyone around here use Powershells with the reflex release? I know that was offered at some point, don't know if it still is.
  • mmosley899mmosley899 Posts: 740 Water Ski Industry Professional
    @jeidmann I would be glad to discuss using your Powershell boots with the MOB release system. FYI, I used double hardshell boots with my system for over twenty years, never had a pre-release, skiing into -39 @ 34mph. Any type boot, releasable or rubber can pre-release if not set up properly for your foot and skiing ability. A few years ago, I switched to a half boot style rear and MOB releasable front. I was surprised at the performance advantages of that style setup once I got accustomed to it. That is the setup I recommend to everybody that does not ski with a simple toe strap plate.
    Mike's Overall Binding www.mobsystemrelease.com
    Sweet Home Alabama Skiing
    Senior Judge, Senior Driver, Tech Controller
    ZmanGloersenDaveD
  • liquid dliquid d Posts: 1,425 Mega Baller
    If you do not have enough FREE PLATE with this stuff in front of and behind your boots, you are in trouble. The binding must stop with several inches left in front of the front foot, and several inches behind the rear boot. 250/250 works just fine. I found that 400/250 was too much and did not release when i thought it should on a 1/4 bouy attempt.
    Nater
  • prkprk Posts: 56 Baller
    jezz miller just gave you his number he is the authority on anything goode disregarde all the other posts
    Deanoski
  • richfosterrichfoster Posts: 126 Baller
    Yeah! Because all others on this forum are just a bunch of idiots.
    HortonNaterBruce_Butterfield
  • swaterkdswaterkd Posts: 95 Baller
    I had that set up and had the stronger interlock on the 4 corners and still came out and broke my leg. My buddy says "crruuuush" I asked what is that? He said the sound of the interlock coming undone!
  • klindyklindy Posts: 2,898 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    And I’ve skied in it for years. Only a couple “bizarre” pre-releases where I made some adjustments and been fine sense. It works. It may not be the best. But I’m not complaining.
    Keith Lindemulder
    AWSA Chairman of the Board

  • MilfordMilford Posts: 132 Open or Level 9 Skier


    My last pre release. This was the one that finally motivated me to make the switch. Now using Goode Powershells with double reflex release.
    GloersenBruce_Butterfield
  • GloersenGloersen Posts: 1,231 Mega Baller
    ^^ hopefully that cruise missile was off target
    BG1
  • lpskierlpskier Posts: 3,767 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    The patented Goode Power Fall.
    John Wilkins- Si non pro sanguine quem ludus ne. #iskiconnelly
    BG1
  • skialexskialex Posts: 1,341 Mega Baller
    Is this qualifies as both feet in?
  • liquid dliquid d Posts: 1,425 Mega Baller
    Your stack needs a little work.
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