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Need guidance on Body position

Eddy_yzEddy_yz Posts: 5
edited October 2011 in Technique & Theory
Hello, my name is Eddy i've been slalom skiing for 3 years now. i'm a free skier and it's one my favorite hobbies, however i have not had any training or lessons and i have taught myself how to ski on my father's outboard motor boat. i KNOW that i need to adjust my position, i think i have problems with the edge to edge transition on both side turns,more so on my offside turn. i feel that most of the time that my ski has too much tip out of the water.
Ihave had a friend take photos of me on both turns in order to see what i'm doing wrong.
I am runing on a 2004 Conelly Hook ski. i'm 6"1 and weight 165 pounds, average boat speed is around 30mph.

Onside Turn:
http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/3890/va2d0522.jpg
http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/4107/va2d0523.jpg
http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/5517/va2d0524.jpg

Offside Turn:
http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/8991/va2d0560.jpg
http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/4648/va2d0561.jpg
http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/1586/va2d0562.jpg

and sometimes i end up with something like this :
http://img840.imageshack.us/img840/3979/va2d0512.jpg , where the ski would just brake and i can't turn.

So i am hoping that someone could guide me give me tips on how to improve my technique and my overall skiing.

Thank You :)

Comments

  • MarcoMarco Posts: 1,409 Crazy Baller
    The first suggestion I would make is to get off the tail of the ski. Push your hips forward with good ankle flex, and pressure your front foot. The water should be breaking under your front foot, and your ski should lay much more horizontal in the water.

    Second suggestion is to get some good gloves. They will save your hands so you can spend more time skiing.

    Good luck, and I'm always happy to see a new ski addict!
  • MattPMattP Posts: 6,007 Mega Baller
    @Eddy_yz first of all welcome to BallOfSpray! Second I agree with what @Marco I saying. A good place to start is getting your hips farther forward. If you are looking for lessons let us know where you are located and we can recommend some great coaches!
  • Thanks for your replies, I will try managing my weight over the ski more evenly next time i'm in the water and see what gives. I'm also getting some gloves.
    Any chance this "wheelie" is being caused by my ski? it's a 66" my front binding and rear toe plate are in the most forward position, the Fin is non adjustable and i've removed the wing.
  • Than_BoganThan_Bogan Posts: 6,479 Mega Baller
    Marco's hit the nail on the head here. You need to bend way more at the ankles (and bend the knees as needed to make that happen).

    That's by far the key thing here, but it does seem possible that your ski is also not set up correctly. I'd consider two possibilities:

    1) What is the spacing between feet? Your back big toe typically should just about touch your front finding. More than an inch gap is bad (for most skiers).

    2) Your binding could be too far forward or too far back. The body automatically overcompensates when the balance is off, so a binding too far forward *can* cause you to end up on the tail. And a binding too far back more obviously could do that.

    WELCOME, GOOD LUCK, AND HAVE FUN!
    Nathaniel Bogan -- GUT Padawan
  • PBDPBD Posts: 190 Baller
    It looks to me like you initiate your turns by killing all of your speed at the apex of your pull and then initiating your edge change which causes you to sink and then you end up on the tail of the ski. You should try and carry your speed through the turn and let the ski come around naturally as it slows and you reach the maximum outward point of your path. This should also allow you to be in a stronger pulling position as you reconnect to the boat and it should also help you do a better job of keeping your arms extended as you come out of your turn.

    Video is a lot easier to critique than still photos.
  • @Than Bogan
    There is no space between the feet , i will try to work on my body position before readjusting the ski , the knee bend and the hip forward is my next objective.
    @PBD Yes i do feel losing momemntum and speed before initiation the edge change and it's more noticable on my offside.

    so for next time i will try to be smoother on the turns , knees and ankles bent and hips forward.

    Thanks a lot guys, all of your replies have been helpful to me. i didn't know i would get get so much feedback, i will try using a videocam next time
  • jaredH20jaredH20 Posts: 90 Baller
    @Than what effect will it have if your feet are spaced further apart? I'm running strada's with the front boot 1 forward of stock and back boot at stock.
  • A_BA_B Posts: 4,149 Mega Baller
    A good stance to practice on dry land is back knee cap touching the rear of the front leg, and front knee over your front ankle. You will feel very athletic with knees slightly flexed.

    Regarding the ski, it could be the fin. I have seen a lot of entry level skis, with non-adjustable fins, with a very deep fin with not much length. This will the tip to ride very high in the turns. If you don't have a caliper you can use a straight edge ruler to see if your fin is way past 2.5" deep. Just place the tip of the ruler on the bottom of the ski running flat against the fin and see if it is closer to 2.5" or 2.75". If it is much past 2.5, you may want to consider an adjustable fin if you can get one for the ski. You can also put washers under the back screws of the fin box to lift the fin up out of the water a little.

    I believe that good form is upmost important, but sometimes the ski can really hinder a beginner from achieving it.





  • HO 410HO 410 Posts: 351 Baller
    How is your rhythm behind the boat? You want to focus more on having an even, smooth rhythm. Making space between yourself and the wakes should not be your primary focus.

    Seth Stisher has a great video called the "whip drill". It's somewhere at waterskitraimer.com. I'll add the specific link when I get the chance to search for it.
    Nikon D80, 50mm f 1.8, Tokina 12-24mm... Sorry, wrong forum. Josh T.
  • davemacdavemac Posts: 450 Baller
    edited October 2011
    here is what HO 410 refers to....
    and ....

    Else, just search youtube for "stisher whips"
  • Than_BoganThan_Bogan Posts: 6,479 Mega Baller
    @JaredH20 It's hard to catalog all the things that *could* go wrong with too much spacing, because it seems to affect different people very differently. I sorta think it has to do with joint flexibility, since the core issue with too much spacing is that you can't bend your front ankle enough while in a balanced (i.e. equal weight on each foot) position. Try exaggerating this on the ground to see what I'm talking about.

    Symptoms that could result include getting too much on the tail, getting too much on the front, having the ski bite hard on one or both sides, having trouble initiating a turn on one or both sides, the wake feeling very hard, and other possibilities.

    But I guess the one fundamental thing to look for is having bad front-to-back stability -- i.e. tending to rock from weight-back to weight-forward positions rather than maintaining a stable balance.

    NOTE: The above is based mainly on chatting with skiers and some general analysis, as opposed to a lot of experience with too-much-spacing setups. So hopefully I haven't said anything totally wrong!
    Nathaniel Bogan -- GUT Padawan
  • jaredH20jaredH20 Posts: 90 Baller
    @Than, thanks for the tip! I did try the boots both std for 1 set when i first got the boots, will try both 1 forward of stock this weekend. Have the Radar Strada which i got 2 months after the boot, definitely improved, can now run 32 much more consistent, but will try it out this weekend as i do feel that "style/technique wise" i'm not consistent which i attribute to not being stable, as my biggest problem is breaking forward on 2 4 6, im LFF, so maybe its this.
  • @ Brent
    I'm from Cyprus, and i ski in the ocean with rough water most of the time, but with winter closing in, the sea is getting calmer.

    I plan to keep on skiing until early December, i'm hoping by December i would have improved my turns to the extent where i can find a smooth rythm in my skiing.
    cheers
  • davemacdavemac Posts: 450 Baller
    Eddy,
    If you go up about six posts, I figure out how to link those videos that were recommended to you.
  • Eddy_yzEddy_yz Posts: 5
    edited October 2011
    @Brent
    Me and my friends have made a small group and we are all progressing together, i know it would be wiser to join a school and take lessons from a pro, but it's more fun that way.
    Besides i have you guys to help me out :D

    @davemac
    yes i can see the videos , also emphasizes on the importance of the balance between your front and back foot, can't wait to get back in the water and try what i have learned. i have also noticed in Seth Stisher videos that edge transition starts as soon as you leave the wake, whereas i would still be pulling for a second or two longer.
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