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What Skill Level equates to "F/GR" class vs. "C" class vs. E/L/R, etc?

ToddLToddL Posts: 2,859 Mega Baller
Just curious what the norm is around the US on these classes... I think we may have some different ideas about the target audiences for "F/GR" vs. "C" vs. the rest.

In your area...
What do you think is the skill level of a typical Class F/GR slalom skier?
Same question but for Class C skier?
At what point do you think a skier is really above Class C events?
-- The future of skiing depends upon welcoming novice skiers regardless of age to our sport.


  • chris_loganchris_logan Posts: 360 Crazy Baller
    At most tournaments I go to, the typical GR skier doesn't run more than 2 passes. That being said, Class C has everything from LL to 39 off. I think skiers (at least at the tournaments I attend) that are above class C are the ones that can run 38 in 2 of the 3 rounds; in general I would say a skier that is above class C is anyone ranking in the top 30 (nationally) in their division.
    Always looking for a pull... Will you be my boatdriver?
  • MarcoMarco Posts: 1,430 Crazy Baller
    It's hard to say from a Colorado point of view. All of the tournaments here are typically C, except when Regionals is held here like last and this year. Our C tournaments have skiers of all levels, from skiing below their max speed, to skiers getting into 39 and the occasional 41. Generally speaking, to ski an E,L or R, us Colorado folks have to travel out of state.
  • bdoughertybdougherty Posts: 86 Baller
    edited January 2014
    Here is what We use in Indiana's Hoosier Buoy Scoring to define levels of skiing and for scoring. This was proposed to be adopted and used state wide. We have found it to work well.

    Hoosier Buoy Tour Scoring
    Skier Divisions
    Grassroots- A grassroots skier is defined as a skier who has never completed a full pass at any speed in a class C Tournament. A skier will ski out of the grassroots division when they complete a full pass at any speed.

    Novice- A novice skier is defined as a skier who has completed a full pass in a tournament at any speed slower than their division’s maximum speed. A skier will ski out the novice division when they run a full pass in a class C tournament or higher at their maximum speed.

    Advanced- Advanced skiers are defined as skiers who have completed a pass at their maximum speed in a class C or higher tournament.

    Division Scoring
    Grassroots-A grassroots skier will receive a minimum of four passes for each tournament round. The highest score of the four passes will be used for score of the round. Scoring will be by buoy count: Green buoys will equal 1 point, Red Buoys will equal 2 points, and the entry and exit gate will each be 1 point. A skier must maintain the course sequence, if a skier misses a buoy (red or green) the pass will be scored from the last rounded buoy. A maximum score of 14 points will move the skier to the novice division where they will be scored with the AWSA buoy count chart.

    Novice- A novice skier may use a one mulligan on an unsuccessful opening pass. After the opening pass a skier will follow AWSA rules for a class C slalom tournament.

    Advanced- Advanced skiers will ski following AWSA rules for a class c
  • Chef23Chef23 Posts: 6,066 Mega Baller
    I think F/GR is good for skiers that have an inconsistent opening pass or two passes. Once someone can run two passes pretty consistently they can ski class C regardless of speed or line length.
    Mark Shaffer
  • LeonLLeonL Posts: 2,469 Crazy Baller
    As far as class "C" being a factor in skill level, I don't think it is. The number of "C" tournaments so far exceeds the number of REL, you get everything in a "C", up to many who ski into 41.
    Leon Leonard Stillwater Lake KY - SR Driver SR Judge
  • skierjpskierjp Posts: 983 ★★★Triple Panda Award Recipient ★★★
    In Florida the majority of tournaments are E,L or R. Some also run a C for the first few skiers but it seems like if the tournament is just C it has a good chance of being cancelled.
  • ToddLToddL Posts: 2,859 Mega Baller
    edited January 2014
    In my area:
    F/GR - for skiers who cannot run a pass, struggle with their opener (hit or miss), or typically cannot run two consecutive passes with any regularity
    C - for skiers who typically run their opening pass and then continue on to harder passes, at any level
    E/L/R - for skiers who meet C criteria but also want to obtain rankings lists, etc.

    So, for us, the primary distinction is about the confidence of the opening pass and ranking lists.

    Trickle down and some amazing up & coming skiers in our area have moved our typical season to more E/L/R based. We used to have C at nearly all tournaments, 1-2 E/L/R at most, and at least 4 F/GR within those C tournaments. Now, we have about 50/50 C vs. E/L/R and no more than 4 F/GR. Typically, only C tournaments add the F/GR sanctions. So the more tournaments move from C to E/L/R the more we lose F/GR events. Kind of hurts our need for growing the sport in my opinion, but I also very much understand how daunting it is to pull off an E/L/R and then also add C or F/GR on top of all of that!

    Also, I should point out that at our F/GR events, the skiers are primarily adults. We never associate F/GR as a youth thing. There are plenty of adult skiers who'd like to experience competition, but need the the F/GR sanction to get their feet wet.
    -- The future of skiing depends upon welcoming novice skiers regardless of age to our sport.
  • HortonHorton Posts: 30,586 Administrator
    I mostly agree with @ToddL (and that pains me to my core)

    The idea of Class F or Grass Roots is awesome but on the south end of the west coast there is ZERO demand. Almost all tournaments here are class C. I never hear of class F/GR events filling up.

    Unless you are interested in an open rating or international ranking a Class R only costs more. There is maybe more pressure and some higher level of skiers on the dock. I don’t generally go out of my way to ski anything above a C.

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  • GloersenGloersen Posts: 1,097 Mega Baller
    F/GR - A skier should be graduated from class F/GR once their score potential exceeds the Level 5 cut-off average; à la rule 3.06

    C - any level skier. "C"s are substantially easier to organize here. I tend to prefer "C"s as 3-rounders are more common, it's a better use of the entire day spent; 3 shots to put up a score that may improve ranking.

    Despite those that may argue driver and judging deficiencies and possibly inflated scores; such is likely site dependent. Many clubs take pride in offering a premium venue. We've been fortunate here to have some very high-level skiers at our "C"s and some very impressive scores; our drivers & judges are found at “R”s, the course well-maintained and always surveyed in tight tolerance.

    International rankings/Open ratings/Records have no bearing on most skiers, albeit "R"s in central FL are great to attend once or twice per year to watch the pros and get some pearls of wisdom from top level skiers.
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